Right now, on Stack Overflow, Luigi Magione’s account has been renamed. Despite having fruitfully contributed to the network he is stripped of his name and his account is now known as “user4616250”.

This appears to violate the creative commons license under which Stack Overflow content is posted.

When the author asked about this:

As of yet, Stack Exchange has not replied to the above post, but they did promptly and within hours gave me a year-long ban for merely raising the question. Of course, they did draft a letter which credited the action to other events that occurred weeks before where I merely upvoted contributions from Luigi and bountied a few of his questions.

  • FaceDeer@fedia.io
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    9 months ago

    Stack Overflow has been toxic for a long time already. It’s one of the things that a lot of people seem pleased to see AI devour.

    • oce 🐆@jlai.lu
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      9 months ago

      I’ve read it is still well valued because people will keep asking questions there when LLM can’t answer, so they remain a precious source of post LLM curated Q&A.

        • oce 🐆@jlai.lu
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          9 months ago

          To be honest, I had a bad experience a few years ago when I wanted to try contributing, and I never tried again. Yet, I think it’s really hard to strike a balance of freedom and constrains for organically curated Q&A, so I try not to be too fast on judging them considering the service that they indubitably provided to millions of people.

        • Goun@lemmy.ml
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          9 months ago

          Until it’s just AIs answering questions asked by other AIs while human admins block human accounts…

        • FaceDeer@fedia.io
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          9 months ago

          Yeah, AI has become good enough at this point that you can provide it with a large blob of context material - such as API documentation, source code, etc. - and then have it come up with its own questions and answers about it to create a corpus of “synthetic data” to train on. And you can fine-tune the synthetic data to fit the format and style that you want, such as telling it not to be snarky or passive-aggressive or whatever.

            • FaceDeer@fedia.io
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              9 months ago

              And yet the synthetic training data works, and models trained on it continue scoring higher on the benchmarks than ones trained on raw Internet data. Claim what you want about it, the results speak louder.

              • JcbAzPx@lemmy.world
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                9 months ago

                This is the peak, though. They require new data to get better but most of the available new data is adulterated with AI slop. Once they start eating themselves it’s over.

                • FaceDeer@fedia.io
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                  9 months ago

                  You are speaking of “model collapse”, I take it? That doesn’t happen in the real world with properly generated and curated synthetic data. Model collapse has only been demonstrated in highly artificial circumstances where many generations of model were “bred” exclusively on the outputs of previous generations, without the sort of curation and blend of additional new data that real-world models are trained with.

                  There is no sign that we are at “the peak” of AI development yet.

                • Ledivin@lemmy.world
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                  9 months ago

                  Nah, I’m still giving that one to the blockchain. LLMs are going to be useful for a while, but Ethereum still hasn’t figured out a real use, and they’re the only ones that haven’t given up and moved fully into coin gambling.

              • justOnePersistentKbinPlease@fedia.io
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                8 months ago

                No, they can only take from things in their models.

                Moreover, all of them use statistics, typically Bayesian, to get the results. What you get from an LLM is essentially an average* of the model data. This is why feeding LLM output into a model is so toxic, it’s already the average.

                • Yes I know it’s not really the average, but for laymen us good enough comparison.
                • naught101@lemmy.world
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                  8 months ago

                  They only take from the statistical distributions of words in the context of preceding words (which is why they never say “the the” etc, why the grammar is nearly always correct). But that doesn’t mean that whole sentences are lifted from the source material. There are near infinite paths through those word distributions, and many have never been produced by humans, so LLMs do produce sentences that have never been uttered before.

                  They couldn’t produce new conceptual context spaces in the way that humans can sometimes, but they can produce new combinations within existing context spaces.

  • circuitfarmer@lemmy.sdf.org
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    9 months ago

    As of yet, Stack Exchange has not replied to the above post, but they did promptly and within hours gave me a year-long ban for merely raising the question.

    Laws mean nothing anymore. Therefore licenses mean nothing. Therefore ownership means nothing, and “theft” no longer exists.

    • caboose2006@lemm.ee
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      8 months ago

      I managed to convince my brother in law by using the wrongful death case of Kanokporn Tangsuan as an example. Framed it as his moral responsibility to never sign up for any digital media ever again since he has a family. I pointed him to a few resources to sail the high seas and he’s got his high seas pc hooked up to his TV and cancelled all his subscriptions. I’m so proud.

    • rumba@lemmy.zip
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      8 months ago

      Therefore ownership means nothing, and “theft” no longer exists.

      WOAH WOAH WOAH… hold on there Circuitfarmer (checks clipboard) It says here you’re not nearly affluent enough to circumvent the law… we’ll be keeping a close eye on you… --BB

      • Zink@programming.dev
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        8 months ago

        In my experience it’s usually the magats who are the ones defending asshole and/or immoral behavior by pointing out that the offender is acting within the bounds of the law or within their legal rights.

        • finitebanjo@lemmy.world
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          8 months ago

          Idk, I feel like Luigi Mangione being a phrase not allowed on Stack Overflow just makes sense. Good policy.

        • finitebanjo@lemmy.world
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          8 months ago

          No their isn’t.

          Stack Overflow is privately owned by Prosus. You have certain limited rights to the content they host but they do not have the obligation to keep the content up and they even have user terms that every account agrees to: especially for moderation.

          • NιƙƙιDιɱҽʂ@lemmy.world
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            8 months ago

            If they’d just removed his content outright, I would agree with you. But if they’ve left his content up without attribution, that does violate the CC agreement, of which they are upheld by.

            I mean, it’s still a small copyright violation who the proprietor of is a bit preoccupied to do anything about, so uh…this whole thing is quite dumb.

            • finitebanjo@lemmy.world
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              8 months ago

              Idk if usernames count as “attribution”, even, but I assume the results would be the same if an account was named Jeremy Assface, Ted Bundy, or Adolf Hitler even if the user’s actual name was such. Not to compare Luigi to any of those people, no, but the point is usernames are moderated.

    • dexa_scantron@lemmy.worldOP
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      9 months ago

      That’s not what the article is about. Stack Overflow has kept content that Luigi created up, but removed his username, in violation of Creative Commons. Edited the post to make that more clear.

      • TachyonTele@lemm.ee
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        9 months ago

        If they weren’t afraid of what he represents they wouldn’t have removed his name.

        • Dasus@lemmy.world
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          9 months ago

          Yeah exactly. And they’re not allowed to under the Creative Commons licence

            • SolaceFiend@lemmy.world
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              9 months ago

              This is the equivalent of a bank robber standing in a vault, filling his bag full of jewels. One of the hostages yelling “You can’t do this, it’s illegal.” Some other guy yells “…and yet…” minutes before police sirens can be heard outside.

              I look forward to Mangiine catching wind of this, which is basically theft, and adding it to the laundry list of things to be tried in court.

          • Hazor@lemmy.world
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            8 months ago

            I doubt before. They’re still hoping they can erase or villainize him. I expect the news media will ignore his trial in favor of whatever antics Trump or Musk are up to, and we won’t hear much about him until there’s a guilty verdict they can parade before the masses in order to dissuade them from copying him. If he does get mentioned, they’ll be trying to frame him in as negative a light as possible and downplay his motives. I also expect the big social media will censor discussion under the guise of not promoting violence, or simply shadow ban any mention of him.

    • Whateley@lemm.ee
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      9 months ago

      Fucking terrified. I’ve never seen corpos circle their wagons like this before. It’s hilarious.

      • Ænima@lemm.ee
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        9 months ago

        I know I am. I’m so sick of this system they’ve created and perpetuated for decades/centuries. I just want to live my fucking life without worrying about basic needs, or how someone with most can take even more from those who have little. Americans have more guns per capita than almost anywhere else. Those are guns in the hands of the people, not mercs or armies or private security. They should be afraid of us. They should be checking their car’s undercarriage daily before getting in. They should vary their routes daily to avoid patterns. They should see every person on the street as a potential assassin. Only THEN, will anything about these parasites’ attitudes change.

        Unfortunately, so many with the skills to engage in revolution are aligned with the interests of these corporate leeches, and thus are fighting the masses, instead of standing with them. They wanted a Civil War #2, it’s time to kick up, not down!

        • sunzu2@thebrainbin.org
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          9 months ago

          Most gun owners are biggest bootlickers out there… They didn’t get weapons to fight corporate tyranny, they got them to shoot poor people they don’t like

          • SolaceFiend@lemmy.world
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            9 months ago

            Actually, they got them to shoot gun-wielding home invaders who threaten (if not attempt to murder) their family members.

  • Agent641@lemmy.world
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    8 months ago

    Reducing someone to a number has never backfired in a revolutionary way. Just ask prisoner 24601

  • Zier@fedia.io
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    9 months ago

    user4616250 will now be a famous meme. “How do we fix healthcare? We call user4616250.”

    • CurlyWurlies4All@slrpnk.net
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      9 months ago

      Do not forget me user4616250

      Look down, look down You’ll always be a slave Look down, look down You’re standing in your grave

      • Clinicallydepressedpoochie@lemmy.world
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        9 months ago

        "He knew that man was me Without a second glance! That Micky Ds employee spotted me The crime stoppers bounty is his chance!

        Why should I try to hide? Why should I go unkown When I have come so far And struggled for so long?

        If I speak, I am condemned. If I stay silent, they have won!

        I am the ceo slayer that got away. They all are looking at me. How can I abandon them? How would they live If I am not free?

        If I speak, I am condemned. If I stay silent, I am damned!

        Who am I? Should not this wage slave benefit Pretend I do not feel his agony This innocent who can be set free

        Who else should face their judgment Who am I? Can I conceal myself for evermore? Pretend I am the man I was before? And hide my crime until I die

        Be no more than an alibi? Must I lie?

        How can I ever face my fellow men? How can I ever face myself again? My fate belongs to capitlism, I know I made that bargain long ago I gave them hope when hope was gone I gave them strength to journey on

        [He appears in front of the court]

        Who am I? Who am I? I’m Luigi!

        [He unbuttons his shirt to reveal the scares of a botched surgery]

        And so UHC, you see it’s true This man bears no more guilt than you! Who am I?

        user4616250!

      • Zier@fedia.io
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        9 months ago

        “calling user 461-62-50, he’s our dude, what he does is nifty!” :)

            • flicker@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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              9 months ago

              Luigi, Luigi, who can I turn to?
              You give me something I can hold onto!
              Things can’t stay the way that they were before
              It’s time to put some villains up on the wall!

              Luigi I got your number!
              I think it’s hero time!
              Luigi don’t change your number!

              Four six one six two five oh!
              Four six one six two five oh!
              Four six one six two five oh!
              Four six one six two five oh!

              Luigi Luigi you’re the guy for me
              Oh, you don’t know me but you make me so happy. I tried to free you but I lost my nerve. I said “nullification” but I got censored

              Luigi I got your number. I think it’s hero time. Luigi don’t change your number

              Four six one six two five oh!
              Four six one six two five oh!
              Four six one six two five oh!
              Four six one six two five oh!

              I got it (I got it) I got it
              Put those assholes on the wall!
              I got it (I got it) I got it
              For the good of, for the good of us all!

              Luigi, Luigi who can we turn to
              (Four six one six two five oh)
              To know our pain, we can always turn to you. (Four six one six two five oh)

        • Flying Squid@lemmy.world
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          9 months ago

          Nice and catchy, but it needs to be catchy with more digits. Tommy “Tutone” Heath is still alive. I’m just saying.

  • The Menemen!@lemmy.world
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    8 months ago

    I am a little tired of the idea that “tech” is something extraordinary. Capitalists in a capitalist society will do all evil to fulfill their goal, t3ch or no tech. You could use the same sentence in everything in this society.

  • Corkyskog@sh.itjust.works
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    8 months ago

    LM Dec 09, 2024

    The second amendment means I am my own chief executive and commander in chief of my own military. I authorize my own act of self-defense in response to a hostile entity making war on me and my family. Nelson Mandela says no form of viooence can be excused. Camus says it’s all the same, whether you live or die or have a cup of coffee. MLK says violence never brings permanent peace. Gandhi says that non-violence is the mightiest power available to mankind. That’s who they tell you are heroes. That’s who our revolutionaries are. Yet is that not capitalistic? Non-violence keeps the system working at full speed ahead. What did it get us. Look in the mirror. They want us to be non-violent, so that they can grow fat off the blood they take from us. The only way out is through. Not all of us will make it. Each of us is our own chief executive. You have to decide what you will tolerate. In Gladiator 1 Maximus cuts into the military tattoo that identifies him as part of the roman legion. His friend asks “Is that the sign of your god?” As Maximus carves deeper into his own flesh, as his own blood drips down his skin, Maximus smiles and nods yes. The tattoo represents the emperor, who is god. The god emperor has made himself part of Maximus’s own flesh. The only way to destroy the emperor is to destroy himself. Maximus smiles through the pain because he knows it is worth it. These might be my last words. I don’t know when they will come for me. I will resist them at any cost. That’s why I smile through the pain. They diagnosed my mother with severe neuropathy when she was forty-one years old. She said it started ten years before that with burning sensations in her feet and occasional sharp stabbing pains. At first the pain would last a few moments, then fade to tingling, then numbness, then fade to nothing a few days later. The first time the pain came she ignored it. Then it came a couple times a year and she ignored it. Then every couple months. Then a couple times a month. Then a couple times a week. At that point by the time the tingling faded to numbness, the pain would start, and the discomfort was constant. At that point even going from the couch to the kitchen to make her own lunch became a major endeavor She started with ibuprofen, until the stomach aches and acid reflux made her switch to acetaminophen. Then the headaches and barely sleeping made her switch back to ibuprofen. The first doctor said it was psychosomatic. Nothing was wrong. She needed to relax, destress, sleep more. The second doctor said it was a compressed nerve in her spine. She needed back surgery. It would cost $180,000. Recovery would be six months minimum before walking again. Twelve months for full potential recovery, and she would never lift more than ten pounds of weight again. The third doctor performed a Nerve Conduction Study, Electromyography, MRI, and blood tests. Each test cost $800 to $1200. She hit the $6000 deductible of her UnitedHealthcare plan in October. Then the doctor went on vacation, and my mother wasn’t able to resume tests until January when her deductible reset. The tests showed severe neuropathy. The $180,000 surgery would have had no effect. They prescribed opioids for the pain. At first the pain relief was worth the price of constant mental fog and constipation. She didn’t tell me about that until later. All I remember is we took a trip for the first time in years, when she drove me to Monterey to go to the aquarium. I saw an otter in real life, swimming on its back. We left at 7am and listened to Green Day on the four-hour car ride. Over time, the opioids stopped working. They made her MORE sensitive to pain, and she felt withdrawal symptoms after just two or three hours. Then gabapentin. By now the pain was so bad she couldn’t exercise, which compounded the weight gain from the slowed metabolic rate and hormonal shifts. And it barely helped the pain, and made her so fatigued she would go an entire day without getting out of bed. Then Corticosteroids. Which didn’t even work. The pain was so bad I would hear my mother wake up in the night screaming in pain. I would run into her room, asking if she’s OK. Eventually I stopped getting up. She’d yell out anguished shrieks of wordless pain or the word “fuck” stretched and distended to its limits. I’d turn over and go back to sleep. All of this while they bled us dry with follow-up appointment after follow-up appointment, specialist consultations, and more imagine scans. Each appointment was promised to be fully covered, until the insurance claims were delayed and denied. Allopathic medicine did nothing to help my mother’s suffering. Yet it is the foundation of our entire society. My mother told me that on a good day the nerve pain was like her legs were immersed in ice water. On a bad day it felt like her legs were clamped in a machine shop vice, screwed down to where the cranks stopped turning, then crushed further until her ankle bones sprintered and cracked to accommodate the tightening clamp. She had more bad days than good. My mother crawled to the bathroom on her hands and knees. I slept in the living room to create more distance from her cries in the night. I still woke up, and still went back to sleep. Back then I thought there was nothing I could do. The high copays made consistent treatment impossible. New treatments were denied as “not medically necessary.” Old treatments didn’t work, and still put us out for thousands of dollars. UnitedHealthcare limited specialist consultations to twice a year. Then they refused to cover advanced imaging, which the specialists required for an appointment. Prior authorizations took weeks, then months. UnitedHealthcare constantly changed their claim filing procedure. They said my mother’s doctor needed to fax his notes. Then UnitedHealthcare said they did not save faxed patient correspondence, and required a hardcopy of the doctor’s typed notes to be mailed. Then they said they never received the notes. They were unable to approve the claim until they had received and filed the notes. They promised coverage, and broke their word to my mother. With every delay, my anger surged. With every denial, I wanted to throw the doctor through the glass wall of their hospital waiting room. But it wasn’t them. It wasn’t the doctors, the receptionists, administrators, pharmacists, imaging technicians, or anyone we ever met. It was UnitedHealthcare. People are dying. Evil has become institutionalized. Corporations make billions of dollars off the pain, suffering, death, and anguished cries in the night of millions of Americans. We entered into an agreement for healthcare with a legally binding contract that promised care commensurate with our insurance payments and medical needs. Then UnitedHealthcare changes the rules to suit their own profits. They think they make the rules, and think that because it’s legal that no one can punish them. They think there’s no one out there who will stop them. Now my own chronic back pain wakes me in the night, screaming in pain. I sought out another type of healing that showed me the real antidote to what ails us. I bide my time, saving the last of my strength to strike my final blows. All extractors must be forced to swallow the bitter pain they deal out to millions. As our own chief executives, it’s our obligation to make our own lives better. First and foremost, we must seek to improve our own circumstances and defend ourselves. As we do so, our actions have ripple effects that can improve the lives of others. Rules exist between two individuals, in a network that covers the entire earth. Some of these rules are written down. Some of these rules emerge from natural respect between two individuals. Some of these rules are defined in physical laws, like the properties of gravity, magnetism or the potential energy stored in the chemical bonds of potassium nitrate. No single document better encapsulates the belief that all people are equal in fundamental worth and moral status and the frameworks for fostering collective well-being than the US constitution. Writing a rule down makes it into a law. I don’t give a fuck about the law. Law means nothing. What does matter is following the guidance of our own logic and what we learn from those before us to maximize our own well-being, which will then maximize the well-being of our loved ones and community. That’s where UnitedHealthcare went wrong. They violated their contract with my mother, with me, and tens of millions of other Americans. This threat to my own health, my family’s health, and the health of our country’s people requires me to respond with an act of war. END

  • OsrsNeedsF2P@lemmy.ml
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    9 months ago

    I cross posted this to Hacker News (which is very pro-CEO and big corpo) and it’s now rank 1 on the front page, lmao. People really support this guy

    (And it’s funny because in the comments, people are seething “Nooooo he’s not popular, look at these polls that show he has 13% approval!!”)

    (Not sharing link to avoid brigade)

    • buddascrayon@lemmy.world
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      8 months ago

      What kind of world have we come into where Hacker News is a pro corporation website?

      Hackers used to be the antithesis of big corporations and capitalist overreach.

    • chiliedogg@lemmy.world
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      9 months ago

      Even if the 13% number were accurate - that’s a pretty damning number. 13% of people supporting someone for gunning down a CEO in cold blood is terrifying to CEOs.

      That’s not 13% hating them. That’s 13% of people celebrating someone for killing them. No lawsuits. No trials. Just gunning them down in the streets. Things have gotten really bad when you have that much of the population actively supporting your murder.

    • Bronzebeard@lemm.ee
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      9 months ago

      Wait, seriously? WTF is it named hacker news? Hackers are the least corporate people out there…

    • Dayroom7485@lemmy.world
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      9 months ago

      The submission has been clearly penalized by hn moderators: Posted 3h ago, upvoted >600 times with almost 500 comments, ranking 23rd on the front page. Ranking first currently is a submission with 80 upvotes, posted 1h ago.

    • ayyy@sh.itjust.works
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      9 months ago

      Lmao it has 3x as many votes as anything else on HN but the moderated pushed it all the way down to page 3 (position 60-something when I just checked).

  • FolknForage@lemm.ee
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    9 months ago

    “No wars but class wars” as true today as when Trotsky said it many decades ago. Not sure how anyone cannot see this very, very clear fact. But every other commoner that sees it needs to take according measures.

  • buddascrayon@lemmy.world
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    8 months ago

    Here’s a fun fact I just recently came across. In the medieval times when the church wanted to remove a heretic, someone who was speaking out in opposition to church doctrine, they would burn those people at the stake. The reason they would do this was not because this was a common practice to burn people at the stake but in order to prevent relics of the heretics from being collected and giving their followers something to rally around.

    I think Luigi’s Stack Overflow history is a relic of his existence and something people could rally around and the powerful don’t want that to exist.

    • Bazoogle@lemmy.world
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      9 months ago

      Plus AI is actually happy to answer your random questions, with an immediate response. Stack overflow will quickly become obsolete as AI gets better

        • bane_killgrind@slrpnk.net
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          9 months ago

          AI is going to get worse, while stack overflow will be superceded by better resources in the future.

          It would be pretty neat if Sal Kahn created an alternative, but that’s very different from his existing project.

    • CodexArcanum@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      9 months ago

      I also stopped posting there years ago for much the same reason. You could feel the strangulation of the community as duplicate questions started getting shouted down, posts got turned into “community wikis” against your will and your own questions started getting edited to better fit someone else’s plans and ideologies. The company was sold shortly after, so maybe animals can sense their pending extinction (some of them anyway)?

      I miss those days when writing an answer genuinely felt like helping to grow the global community of friend developers. It’s a shame no technology has been discovered that will let the small amount of collective good in us all work together against the assholes, but alas it seems the opposite is always true.

      • GreatAlbatross@feddit.uk
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        8 months ago

        “How do I get this working in 22.04?”

        “Previous question answers this.” Tagged as best answer

        “No, the previous question answers it with a method that was removed in 22.04”

        silence

      • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
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        9 months ago

        The company was sold shortly after, so maybe animals can sense their pending extinction (some of them anyway)?

        More likely the changes were made to improve the “saleability” of the website.

        I miss those days when writing an answer genuinely felt like helping to grow the global community of friend developers.

        One of the promises of the internet was, supposedly, that it couldn’t really be monopolized because the barriers to entry were so low. But what we’ve seen is the influence of the Networking Effect as a means of consolidating user bases, combined with a cartel-style censorship that limits the degree to which word-of-mouth can influence a nascent community’s growth.

        And now the AI comes to fully alienate us from each other, leaving even the more token communities with a “am I talking to a real person or a computer facsimile” lingering dread with each passing year.

      • manicdave@feddit.uk
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        9 months ago

        What’s even more annoying is when their refinements end up putting an objectively wrong answer as the authoritative record.

        I found a question where someone new to electronics was how to get more current from a USB power supply.

        The “correct” answer that was posted before the question was closed was that a source can’t limit current and the questioner should learn more about electricity.

        The actual correct answer - and probably what the questioner was looking for - is to short the data lines together because a compliant USB charger will only supply 500mA by default, not it’s stated max current.

        • Echo Dot@feddit.uk
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          9 months ago

          What drives me mad is when a question is closed as a duplicate, and when you look at the duplicate it’s either for a different version of the product and thus the answer isn’t relevant, or the question straight up wasn’t answered there either.

      • BrianTheeBiscuiteer@lemmy.world
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        9 months ago

        your own questions started getting edited to better fit someone else’s plans and ideologies

        That hits hard for me. Not that someone changed the spirit of my answer but that someone completely reworded it without my permission. It was almost like they were trying to steal my idea without running afoul of copyright or something.

    • interdimensionalmeme@lemmy.ml
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      9 months ago

      It’s 40% assholes People who delete “Hi,” From the first line of the question Because a modicum of politeness and humanity is inefficient And don’t get me started about the XY problem solvers Stack exchange gamifies rudeness and dismissiveness.

    • Echo Dot@feddit.uk
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      9 months ago

      You can just ask an AI anyway since it’s training set will basically just be stackoverflow.

      • sus@programming.dev
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        9 months ago

        the entirety of stackoverflow is not enough data to make the AI work properly. They need terabytes of text, stackoverflow has about 50-100GB of useful data at most

      • drspod@lemmy.ml
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        9 months ago

        Just tried this and the AI told me my question was a duplicate and my post was removed.