Board of education replaces course at 12 public universities with own US history curriculum, in latest ‘anti-woke’ attack
Educators are warning that college enrollment in Florida will plummet after the state removed sociology as a core class from campuses in the latest round of Ron DeSantis’s war on “woke ideology”.
The Republican governor’s hand-picked board of education voted on Wednesday to replace the established course on the principles of sociology at its 12 public universities with its own US history curriculum, incorporating an “historically accurate account of America’s founding [and] the horrors of slavery”.
The board faced a backlash last summer for requiring public schools to teach that forced labor was beneficial to enslaved Black people because it taught them useful skills.
The removal as a required core course of sociology classes, which Florida education commissioner and staunch DeSantis acolyte Manny Díaz insisted without evidence had “been hijacked by leftwing activists”, follows several other recent “anti-woke” moves in education in Florida.
Could this result in accreditation being pulled, which could make federal student financial assistance unavailable?
If it doesn’t, it should.
The fewer people we have studying society, the better society will be!
Also, drink up! I’m funnier when you do!
The fewer people we have laundering their activism through academia, the better academia will be!
You mean like DeSantis is doing right now?
Wow we got a real activist over here trying to launder activism through comment threads, smh.
Get thee behind me, Deceiver.
The party of small government.
the party of constant rancid hypocrisy and bigotry.
Every school in Florida losing their accreditation over this would be a dream come true! Come on Ronny boy, sink that ship!
makes me feel bad for kids who can’t afford out of state tuition, tho
What wrong with learning? Annoying, frustrating.
They like learning, but only if you learn what they want you to learn.
That’s literally the definition of indoctrination, which is ironic considering that is what they are purportedly trying to prevent.
The irony being that they want to make sure students in Florida aren’t indoctrinated with facts supported by evidence because that is fucking woke.
It’s not ironic; it’s just them blatantly lying.
You misunderstand. They just want their indoctrination.
Oh no, I understand just fine. They are rigging the system to create an entire generation if ignorant wage slave voters regardless of whether they have the means to attain higher education or not. This in turn creates a cycle that is incredibly hard to break, and that has far reaching repercussions on the electorate for years to come.
That’s literally the definition of indoctrination, which is ironic considering that is what they are purportedly trying to prevent.
And, of course, they’re doing the same thing with “freedom”.
Education is antithetical to conservative beliefs.
Although the general education classes like psychology and sociology are annoying, they’re all essential knowledge for being an educated human being. It’s a shame Florida wants their population to be ignorant conservatives.
It’s a shame Florida wants their population to be ignorant conservatives.
Look at the entrance polls for the Republican primaries.
There’s a 30 point spread between Trump’s support depending if the person went to college or not.
How much is correlation vs cause and effect is debatable, but certainly in a democracy an educated public can’t hurt.
classes like psychology and sociology are annoying
Sociology was my favorite general ED class outside of my discipline. I’m sure it varies by teacher but it can be really fun and interesting!
Sociology maybe, I don’t know about the intro to psychology experience of ‘hey check out all these famous theories, paradigms, and experiments. At least half of which are largely disproven or under serious doubt but we wont say which.’
Depends on the school and professor I guess. My intro to psych class made it clear how much older paradigms are, basically, just flights of fancy, however there is a foundation of moving towards a system of discovery and diagnoses that was important, instead of literally super natural explanations. With new stuff they went over how difficult it is to create solid proofs and the reasons why. They also would do what they could to make sure we understood why they came to the conclusions they did and the short comings of those reasons and practices.
Yeah much better, ‘hey check out a half century of our field producing mostly bullshit, this is a good use of your time.’
My point being if you can’t put together a full 1 term curriculum of “here are the fundamentals of our field that we are sure or 99% sure about” then maybe its not a productive use of time to require every single college student spend a class on it.
If you want a history of science class then have a history of science class.
Well I am sorry that you see no value in understanding how the thing you are studying came to be. However, the majority of people do. Literally every subject I learned did this.
I don’t remember chemistry 101 being 70% about alchemy and phlogiston. This is almost exclusively a phenomenon with intro psychology classes.
If you want to study it fine whatever but there’s no reason it should be a standard GE requirement instead of something like philosophy of science.
You went to a very different school than I did. We absolutely learned about the development of chemistry in introductory courses. Same with mathematics, physics, etc. This even included getting into how they co-developed. There was a deeper dive into in the liberal arts because it’s it is more important, as they are less mechanical, but STEM definitely got into the basic history of the subject.
i would add to this that early conceptualizations of psychology have had massive cultural impacts. if you enjoy art, film, literature from the last century and change, it’s worth knowing about Freud and Jung.
their ideas represent an evolution of thinking about people, their minds, their relationships to others and to their environment or to god, but they also underpin so much we take for granted at present in popular culture and day-to-day conversation (at least in “the west”).
Yes, didn’t want a wall of text explaining all the context the course provided about the different times and now. The roots of it are clearly what we would now consider quackery. However the simple foundational idea that there is something identifiable, explainable, and maybe curable was revolutionary. This was in a time when explanations ran from miasma to demonic possession. So it is worth knowing about for the historical perspective, I totally agree. I was just more sorta shocked there are professors still telling people that our scientific body is the ultimate facts on the matter.
Don’t worry, not just the old ones are pseudoscientific
classes like psychology and sociology are annoying
It’s a bummer that you had that experience. Mine were absolutely fascinating. That said, my school had some flagship social science departments, so the people that instructed there were not the b-team.
If a university doesn’t have a good program in a particular discipline, good people don’t want to work there, and the current staff often don’t have the expertise to hire for it.
They’re alright classes. I enjoyed the professors I had but I feel like the majority of people want to speed through the GEs and get going on their actual major classes.
Besides for my intro to philosophy course I don’t think I got much out of my GEs.
I remember writing a research paper on roe v wade not to long ago. Thought it would be an easy paper that’s kind of socially acceptable and not at all controversial. Found out that conservatives do wild shit like kill doctors and harass rape victims. I hate society.
The quality of an overall department and the quality of classes taken by non-majors to fulfill degree requirements are two different things. For example, my university has a great architecture school, but that didn’t stop the “history of industrial design” class I took to fulfill my art requirement (as an engineering major) from being mostly an exercise in memorizing pictures of chairs.
English comp at RIT back when it was trimesters. I’ll never understand. Not a technical writing class or shutting that could really benefit a tech heavy student base. English comp freshman year. Miserable.
Thankfully I transferred in and didn’t have to take miserable English courses by a tech focused University. The technical writing course I had to take at RIT was easy mode. The guy gave us all of the homework for the entire quarter on the first day and as long as it was all turned in before then, that was ok. It was a required class that I personally did not need due to my previous education and I don’t think I spent more than a few hours total to get an A.
Yeah i desperately needed a technical writing course at that age. I was a hot mess. I most certainly didn’t need an English comp class where i was actually required to turn in one of those awful black and white composition pads at the end to pass. I hard noped and took it the next trimester with a bunch of upper class kids who needed it and it was a walk in the park.
It was a shame that a lot of classes at RIT could be really hit or miss depending on the professor. I graduated before they went to semesters, and you had no time to be sick, lost, or behind. I tried to sign up for an extra class every quarter so I could have the option to withdraw from one of them and still be full time. Knowing when to withdraw, especially not waiting until the last minute, was a lesson I wished I knew that first year I was there.
Technical writing is very much not the same as general English composition, and I always hated it when schools lump it together. To this day I still work with people who don’t even know where to start. Having a bunch of robotics engineers balk at having to write documentation about their own designs blew my mind. It wasn’t even the manuals, just general design and functional specifications. Less than 10 pages, half of them pictures. I was nice and made the skeleton for them with some notes on what information I needed in which sections. Hopefully, they learned from it.
Did your university have a good industrial design or product design department? Industrial design is very very different than architecture. (I went to school for industrial design and instructed university courses in the department)
It appears to be ranked in the top 10 in the lists I checked, so yes.
Interesting. Bummer that you got a shit class. Mine GE history glass was pretty good, and it got into the different design movements, what drove them, and how they impacted industrialization, usability, accessibility, and other elements of contemporary life.
ignorant conservatives
If you’re referring to today’s definition of “conservative”, then that’s redundant.
When was conservatism not ignorant? Certainly not in my lifetime. It’s been an ideology of anti-intellectualism for at least three decades now.
It’s been an ideology of anti-intellectualism for at least three decades now.
30 years is maybe pushi… Oh wait, that’s only 1994. Yeah, you’re right.
True, but now it’s off the rails.
I feel like Conservatism USED to be “How can we save money and prepare for a better financial future as a country/state/etc.?”…
It kind of moved along the lines of “How can we stop
financiallysupporting things and people that are different to us?”Now, the financial part is just an excuse.
The word you’re looking for is “Reagan”.
I feel like Conservatism USED to be “How can we save money and prepare for a better financial future as a country/state/etc.?”…
No, that’s always been nothing more than a lie conservatives tell to try to excuse their abhorrent policies.
What conservatism really used to be was defending the monarchy, and it still is. I was going to say “…and the only thing that’s changed is that they no longer try to use ‘divine right’ as a justification and prefer a different title for the autocrat in charge,” but nope!
Every conservative I know I have tricked into defending the British at the Boston Massacre and at the Boston Tea Party. Just don’t drop the name of the event and they will go nuts. Kids throwing snowballs at police? No wonder they got shot, they asked for it. Adults breaking into private property and destroying it, that’s not a protest that’s a riot!
Now, the financial part is just an excuse.
Indeed, and they have no problem pissing away taxpayer dollars for migrant flights, lawsuits, etc.
Nobody is going to respect any kind of degree from these universities.
Why would you pay to go to school where your credentials will mean Jack shit to anyone?
What a joke.
Only if you go to a conservative Christian institution or workplaces, which is not many I can imagine.
they do mention it’s 12 public universities
Right, because they’re the only ones that the state of Florida has control over.
I’m not going to look it up to confirm, but I would guess that’s all of their state universities.
Brain drain on a state-level.
One wonders what will happen to these schools’ accreditations, really.
I mean, if you’re teaching something you call history and you don’t teach students how to put the course content in its historical context and interrogate those sources critically, you’re not teaching them history, you’re indoctrinating them.
…tho to be fair, that’s honestly what passes for US History in most US schools. The more history I learn, the more I realize most of us aren’t taught
I mean if you’ve been following the news on university leadership, I don’t think Florida universities are the only ones in trouble
That’s what Derpsantis wants, a state full of workers that have no choice but to fall into the labor and low rung office pool.
The elite DON"T want normal kids getting degrees, because then they compete (successfully) with their ignorant as shit trustfund crotchfruit.
I mean, people paid to attend trump ‘university’. There are always plenty of fools who will buy stupid shit. I kind of feel sorry for the students though. Most people are pretty young at university age and many are still forming their perspectives. Getting away from home and meeting new people is an important part of this. Plenty of people from conservative families go away to uni and start to see that they’ve been brought up on bullshit. This is an attempt to stop that from happening - the ‘anti-woke’ shit will attract more conservative students which will reduce the chance that any of them will encounter different views and cultures so they stay in their ignorance bubble. Don’t want little Johnny or Jane coming home from school an anarchist! It’s sad for the students though who will come away in massive debt with a useless degree and have less opportunity for healthy change.
He doesn’t care. He really doesn’t care.
He cares deeply about white fragility and the rich history of the Confederacy.
I really, really wanted to move to Florida. It was my dream. I finally adulted, quit drinking, quit smoking, got my shit together. Now, I’m in a position where I could move but there’s no way in hell I’d even go back there on vacation now. They’ve ruined the state, ruined my dream.
You’re not missing anything, trust. It’s a terrible state.
I really wanna go to Key West again, but I legit feel bad spending any of my money in modern-day FL. They totally ruined it.
Do… do they understand that sociology is at best tangentially connected to socialism?
Can you blame them? They did attend schools in Florida afterall.
That would require knowing what sociology is
The word sounds vaguely scary and that is sufficient.
Obviously not.
Probably not.
US’s biggest problem IMO is undereducation. Lots of people seems to lack basic intellectual auto-defense skill. It’s been a problem for a long time, but given how easy AI makes it to create disinformation, the shit will eventually hit the fan and even the GOP will be beging for a minimal education cursus to fix the mess they created.
Education is valued in certain circles. But in others its utterly useless. In most trades it is looked down on.
In a democracy, education is always useful.
Tradespeople are educated, they’re just not university educated - they’re educated at a vocational education level. If they’re not educated, they’re not qualified, so they’re just a handyman. What are you trying to say? Even people who perform non-qualified roles receive education on-the-job.
This is my exact point. An education in this context is higher learning in a form of a degree or some sort of academic persuit. I don’t think it as a more than or less than. It’s just a different path.
You aren’t wrong. Which is why I push the younger guys with any brains to get an engineering degree. Some do some don’t.
It’s because education is sold as a way to get a job. Nobody communicates the value of being an educated person other than the salary one could potentially make.
I think it’s two branch to a tree. I’m confused why I’m being down voted when it really seems everyone agrees with my premise. It’s not my fault I’m pointing out how it’s perceived.
My guess is it’s because it looks like your second sentence is saying education is useless when the people around you don’t value it.
Yea. Tell that to my life that has only benefited since I earned my degree. I have more interviews. I have more options. I earn more money and have more responsibilities. I guess that it’s valued by some, but it’s valued by me.
I’m confused why I’m being down voted when it really seems everyone agrees with my premise. It’s not my fault I’m pointing out how it’s perceived.
They like to ‘Kill the Messenger’ here on Lemmy a lot, for some reason.
Which is really not healthy for Lemmy in the long run, but that’s a whole other discussion to be had.
It’s a fundamental flaw of the vote system. Downvotes are just an “I disagree/I don’t like that/Boo!” button.
It’s a fundamental flaw of the vote system. Downvotes are just an “I disagree/I don’t like that/Boo!” button.
It’s not so much the button itself, but how it’s used, which is the problem.
When it’s used as a weapon to attack someone, and not just for disagreeing with what they’re saying, is what I’m speaking towards. That irresponsible use of the button. That’s not healthy for Lemmy.
Granted that button press, even when used responsibly, can mean different things two different people, which I think is what you were speaking towards.
I say that the way it is being used is an inevitable result of its existence; a downvote button will always turn out this way. I don’t think you can have downvotes without it turning into an “I disagree/I don’t like that/Boo!” button. Hence, a fundamental flaw of the system.
Well yeah, the problem is a large portion of tradesmen are often misguided or just wrong on like every topic in the first place. My experience with welders and specific types of electricians, for example, is mostly filled with extremely misogynist people who take pride in ignorance. They aren’t very reliable for opinions on education or even common sense. Of course, this doesn’t apply to all tradesmen by any means, but those who aren’t like this are likely to get strongarmed into acting the same or just get bullied out of the field. Like these are professions where employers will decide to not hire you based on the vehicle you drive, you have to conform to this “culture” of theirs in order to be taken seriously.
Something which doesn’t really apply to “lower” skill welders, but I’ve heard from some “higher” skill (pipe/aerospace) welders, is complaints about not being able to do basic arithmetic&algebra or understand trigonometry… I’m not ripping on them, but they’ve seemingly had a lot of annoying situations and wasted a lot of time because they don’t know multiplication well, and don’t understand the logic behind the mathematics that they frequently encounter in their job. Sure, a lot of times the mathematics in trades can just be measuring and reading schematics and nothing else, but some work needs that kind of education and most tradesmen just seem to not have it.
Other types of education involved with communication, psychology, sociology, etc. can be extremely important for these professions, even if they don’t affect the manual labour itself. A job is usually a lot more than just doing the work you were tasked to do, you have to actually discuss with people, and a lot of tradesmen completely lack skills in that department to the point it frequently causes issues…
I teach in an electrical apprenticeship and I don’t find that, students are eager to know more. What I do find is that my students are undereducated in logic and critical thinking skills. I get a lot of “can you just make me a checklist I can follow.”
I have spent a lot of time in construction or logistics to construction sites. For several different disciplines. It’s not that they don’t have the drive to learn. I find they don’t respect my knowledge of logistics or how certain mechanisms work. It’s not isolated to my own experience as well. There are several people that sell college is pointless. Get a job and get your hands dirty. I think it’s a viable option. I also think college is valuable as well. It depends on the person and their goals.
I get a lot of “can you just make me a checklist I can follow.”
I’m teaching computer networking and this hits the nail on the head. My students are plenty willing to learn answers to multiple choice questions. However, it is like pulling teeth trying to give them anything even slightly open ended. Sorry, at your real job the boss isn’t going to come up to you in a panic and say “the network went down, which of these 4 answers is the reason?”
Troubleshooting, researching, and having curiosity are all important in this field. I’m having difficulty getting them to see that, or care.
Troubleshooting, researching, and having curiosity are all important in this field.
Me and my millenial siblings went to good schools, college, etc, but nothing at school seemed to encourage these things. In school it felt like a lot of tricks on how to be successful on multiple choice and short essay tests.
We were all typically ahead of our peers I think because at home we were taught art and handywork, how to research and solve problems on our own, how to think critically and be curious from a young age.
Among my cohort it seemed like the arts and creativity were seen as totally separate from technical work like programming. But some of the most successful people I’ve known in the computer science field have been very artistic as well. There are skills you learn outside of the typical ‘hard science’ curriculum that seem neglected.
What did you get a degree in? I studied philosophy, so I did a shitload of very long papers and open-ended assignments that required a lot of reading, researching, and critical thinking. I feel like a lot of STEM students completely miss out on this element of college.
I feel like a lot of STEM students completely miss out on this element of college.
Nah, they’re all already much better writers than the English majors because they read Dune and Foundation, and they understand history better than the history majors because they pulled up like a million wikipedia pages while Call of Duty was installing, and they’re more attuned to the needs of the government than the poli-sci majors because they listened to three TED talks. ;-)
Now, I’m mostly kidding. I know that most STEM majors write better than most English majors can do calculus; I’m just saying that I’ve known some engineers and doctors who confused that basic competence with mastery.
It’s interesting how conservatives are using the power of the state to mold the population to their liking.
Surely Repubs wouldn’t tell lies that they want “small government” while simultaneously legislating what we can learn, who we can love, and what women are allowed to do with their bodies?
And here is what will happen next: The 47th president of the USA , donning golden sneakers, will make America great again, this time for real, in their alternate reality. His tropical White House in Palm Beach, FL, where confidential documents are stored in a “safe bathroom,” is a demonstration that “there is no need to spend money” and everything is small (including his hands and his mushroom shaped…feet).
The government will make sure that there is no regulation on guns, but right to chose will be banned for good, so that the “barbarian women” don’t do anything to babies - these will be able to pay more taxes in the future, for the smallest government.
Slavery will be taught to have been the greatest hoax, and books will explain that it allowed people to get on their feet and buy their freedom.
There will be no limit on what tax savings the rich can get, including receiving money back they didn’t pay, by receiving loans that are forgiven later, and every worker household will have had a chance to pay more taxes, while being fed that taxes are being lowered.
Healthcare marketplace will end, because the 47th will come up with a better plan after killing what exists already. Universal healthcare will be given to all Americans, and will consist of everyone having the right to one primary care physician visit per year, then complement healthcare needs with access to bank loans, to do whatever other treatment one may need. It will be a beautiful plan, the greatest plan… no sick left behind. The economy will grow because banks will have branches inside hospitals and pharmacies; banks will have trillions in loans due to them at all times. Debt will increase, sure, but who cares, current Repubs won’t be around to pay for it.
I’d completely forgotten that we all discovered the president has a nasty little mushroom dick. I’d actually manage to put the image of that man’s malformed cock out of my mind. You just reminded me. Bastard.
He dismissed the idea that it was little and ordered his staff to show the actual size. The folks in the south were able to source a specimen of size and actual proportions in their alternate reality.
I think you’re describing the movie Idiocracy.
First on their agenda, reading is for queers
/s
Brilliant, it is a plot for a movie!!
In “Idiocracy: Making America Great Again,” we dive headfirst into an alternate reality where the 47th president of the USA, sporting golden sneakers and a penchant for grandiosity, leads America down a path of absurdity and excess. His tropical White House in Palm Beach, FL, complete with a “safe bathroom” for confidential documents, epitomizes his mantra of “spending less, achieving more” – even if everything, including his hands and his mushroom-shaped feet, is smaller than advertised.
Under his reign, guns are glorified and regulation-free, while the right to choose is brutally snatched away to ensure the “barbarian women” don’t interfere with the future tax-paying workforce. Slavery is whitewashed as a stepping stone to freedom, and tax breaks for the wealthy flow like champagne at a yacht party, with the middle class left to foot the bill under the guise of “lower taxes for all.”
But fear not, for universal healthcare emerges as the president’s pièce de résistance – a masterstroke of simplicity where every American is entitled to one primary care physician visit per year, with the rest of their medical needs financed through bank loans. It’s hailed as the greatest plan in history, despite leaving most citizens one illness away from bankruptcy.
As banks thrive within hospitals and pharmacies, debt skyrockets, but who cares when the future is someone else’s problem? With “Idiocracy: Making America Great Again,” prepare for a rollercoaster ride through a world where the motto is “Welcome to Costco, I love you!” and absurdity reigns supreme and the only certainty is laughter through the tears.
By Fox Films
Wouldn’t need large government if people
just thought the same waystill had VALUES!
It’s
interestingterrifying how conservatives are using the power of the state to mold the population to their liking.FTFY
Gonna be real fun when pilots from FL decide they’re gonna let Jesus take the wheel. Maybe better than MCAS 🤷♂️
What the fuck Florida?
deleted by creator
By “pilots from FL” do you mean ERAU alumni?
If you already have your wings, is your education influenced by the current state of Florida schools?
So in 10 years I’m gonna start asking job applicants where they went to high school… and I won’t hire Floridians, because I know they are uneducated.
This is a joke right?
Definitely not.
There are terrible highschools all around the US. Someone taking AP classes in Florida still will have learnt more than someone taking only general classes and passing with C’s and D’s outside of Florida. Be realistic.
Why wait?
I cannot think of a reason 😅 sorry Florida, your spawn isn’t qualified.
“the belief there are systemic injustices in American society and the need to address them.”
For those wondering, this is the definition of “woke” by Rhonda Sandtits lead counsel.
Being “anti-woke” is a dog whistle for racism, sexism, xenophobia and bigotry.
Good argument, but in my opinion (and it’s just like, my opinion, man), calling him Rhonda Sandtits is weird if you’re pro-trans (or at least anti-anti-trans.)
It’s also confusing. I thought it was his wife or something.
