Because I forgot what it was like
Can’t forget something that doesn’t exist.
It did but you wasn’t aware of it at the time
Afraid? Hardly. More like
Memes like this just make me get anxious thinking about the past
I’m looking forward to the nothingness, the first 14billion years was nice enough. It’s the time between everyday life and nothingness that worries me.
Just had a friend die of a heart attack while working in construction with his friends. Didn’t make it to the hospital.
That’s how I want to go. Just times up one day.
So sorry for your loss. You’re right - your friend is “fine” now. It’s the people we leave behind that can have a hard time with it.
Thanks
Because now I know what I’d be missing.
Times like that, we experience it in one direction only
Because there is no coming back.
Why are you so sure about this? Believing there is no reincarnation is just a religious dogma of Christianity or rather all abrahamitic religions and therefore deeply engraved in our culture so we don’t even consider other possibilities. Similar to how in buddhist and hinduistic cultures reincarnation is the default way of imagining life before birth and after death.
So where do the „extra“ humans come from in these religions? What I mean is the increasing number of people being alive at the same time.
I don’t believe in a soul. That is definitely not religious dogma.
The idea that reincarnation is the default and one would have to be indoctrinated against it is… I would say, a very interesting position to take, if I’m being polite.
An arrogant position even.
Believing there is no reincarnation is just a religious dogma of Christianity
No, it is pretty much the default position until you can prove that it happens.
Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
Especially if declining to look.
Same as with God? I don’t think so. Don’t you think there are things that cannot be proven or disproven? My point is the default position depends on the cultural background.
Believing there is no reincarnation is just a religious dogma of Christianity
I don’t know that that’s true.
We as a society don’t know what happens when we die, conscious-wise. To state “we definitely do come back” or “we definitely don’t” would be incorrect, just like saying “there’s definitely aliens” vs “there definitely are not”.
However, we can use evidence we’ve gathered over thousands of years of existence and make assumptions. Unless I’m mistaken, there’s little evidence that has been accepted by the scientific community (Western or Eastern) to support reincarnation, so to say that “we don’t come back” is a Christian dogma is a little unfair.
To be clear I don’t have a strong opinion on reincarnation. I’ve heard compelling stories that are hard to explain otherwise, but I feel like we’d have been able to gather at least some concrete data on it over the span of our existence.
That’s exactly my point. What’s the concrete data against reincarnation would someone from a buddhist culture ask (probably even when they aren’t religious). I am just saying what we accept as default and for what we demand evidence depends on the cultural background.
I might have formulated it exxagerated. But believing in “YOLO” is as evidence based as believing in reincarnation.
Similar as atheism is a belief as well: believing that there is no god. How do they know? It seems my point of view is more agnostic than most here.
Words like “atheism” or “agnostic” make sense as shorthands for everyday conversations or labelling, but if you want to be rigorous about it, it makes more sense to use 4 categories:
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Gnostic theist: I know there’s a God, I’ve met Him, I feel it, I have faith, etc.
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Agnostic theist: I don’t know if there’s a god or not, but I prefer to believe there’s one
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Agnostic atheist: if we don’t know if there’s a god or not, there’s no reason to believe there’s one. Do you assume there’s an invisible giant teapot orbiting Earth because there’s no proof to the contrary?
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Gnostic atheist: a god can’t possibly exist, the concept of a god is illogical, etc.
I’m agnostic atheist, but maybe there could a firm reasoning for the gnostic atheist position. I don’t know, I would have to read and think about it more.
Interesting categories, but I don’t find myself in any of them: We don’t know if there is a god therefore I neither believe in its existence nor in its non-existence because it doesn’t matter anyway. If god(s) exist they either don’t affect human lives or they do it without letting us know how and why. In both cases there is no reasons to change anything in my life.
I think this view is called apathetic or pragmatic agnosticism.
I don’t know, that seems very similar to agnostic atheism to me. Is there any situation where you would act differently if you’d consider yourself agnostic atheist instead of apathetic agnostic?
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Brother, you and I are the universe recycled / reincarnated over and over again living life one day at a time like a real metaverse. This consciousness is a dream, although we can’t tell because we’re inside the dream. Unlike the dreams in our sleep, biting this finger hurts for real, but real is a thing you perceive just like how we perceive money to be real in an engaging game of Monopoly.
This is the way. Life can only be recognized as such in the context where an absence of life is also present, but ultimately both (life and no-life) are just interpretations of what we call existence.
We only get one ride in this rollercoaster and half of us want to make the ride living hell for the rest of us.
Half? Try an alarming small number and they are damn good at it.
I used to think I didn’t dream, eventually I realized that the blissful nothingness I (don’t) experience between sleeping and waking up was the dream.
Keep a dream journal, eventually you’ll start remembering them.
Ah, I don’t believe it’s a case of not remembering.
Many nights I simply do not dream of anything at all, or at least when I wake up I have absolutely no recollection of dreaming about something.
I do also have dreams that fade after awhile as you’d expect, and have occasionally written down things I found interesting about them, but overall my dreams are an infrequent occurrence.
You either do it diligently because you want to dream more, or you don’t because you’re fine “not dreaming”.
I don’t care either way, but intentionality and belief are a factor. Doesn’t sound like it’s a goal/intention of yours currently, and that’s fine. Continue to not dream or not recall your dreams.
I’m sorry that sharing my personal choices and experiences has aggravated you so much 🙄
🔇
Oh boy, sleep! That’s where I’m a Viking!
I have never experienced unending nothingness, only noted the nothingness after it was over
That’s a good point, though I think it’s also fair to say that you won’t experience unending nothingness after death from that perspective, either. I can see how coming to accept that the world existed before our experience began could help one confront the world will continue to exist after our experience has ended.
This is a very deep and true post for a shitpost. It’s basically when you go to sleep and don’t dream, but you don’t wake up. It’s just a black void of nothingness.
Now I know something to compare it to.
apparently I literally tried to strangle myself on my umbilical cord in the womb but my take on that was that I knew what was coming.
Just like The Butterfly Effect ending we watched in class!
yeah my husband brought this up a few days ago actually and was talking about the movie and I was like do you remember me mentioning that I literally actually did that? 4 times around apparently!
Damn, well done.
if my mother hadn’t forced me out early to intentionally lower my birth weight (I’m the last child and size tends to increase with subsequent births, my next oldest sibling complicated delivery by size alone) I might’ve succeeded too.
We live and we die, but we don’t start or stop existing. Everything that is us is still here. And in time, what was us becomes something new and different.
The miracle of life is a rare and magical opportunity for a bit of our grand panoply of matter to direct its own future. And, I believe, the horror of death is in that return to idleness and loss of control. We don’t want to return to the sidelines, to be put back on the shelf. We don’t want to become mere stuff again. We want to keep playing the game.
The key is to accept that the end of consciousness is a feature of existence, and not a bug.
Cope harder meatbag
Fact’s
🤯 😭
nothingless
Idk, sounds kinda scary. Idk what it was like before, because I lacked consciousness to experience it. And the idea that it all ends, back to nothingness forever. We live a few years. Pretty much nothing, if we consider the forever before, and the forever after our existence.
It’s something I recall fearing as a kid, due to the scary unknown. Glad to have enjoyed a decade of bliss. Too bad the fear has come back to haunt me. It’s not constant, though. Sometimes it comes, outta nowhere. Real strong. Not fun. But I don’t live day to day in fear.
The thing is, once youre dead, there won’t be consciousness, you will not have any perception of a void, you won’t know anything because you will not be.
Marc Maron put it into good perspective. He was hiking in the hills and passed out. He noted that he could very well have been dead, and that would have been that. He wasnt scared because he wasnt conscious.
You can’t be afraid when you dont exist and you will not be aware of anything.
The thing is, once youre dead, there won’t be consciousness, you will not have any perception of a void, you won’t know anything because you will not be
Do we really know this though?
What if upon death we exit the simulation?
Sometimes I think non-sim me decided to play life on hard mode. I’d kind of like to kick his ass for that. But then I realize he is me.
You can’t know until then, so what is the value in worrying?
I don’t believe in God nor am I religious, but consciousness just feels so fucking weird man. Everything in the world can be explained through science and physics, cause and effect, hell even our brains and actions are just a chain of atoms interacting. But consciousness just feels so out of place. Why am I? Why am I even aware of my own existence? Why has a set of atoms resulted in my non-material consciousness? It feels so out of place. Why isn’t it just a bunch of atoms bumping into eachother, why am I capable of feeling and thinking?
I think about this more than anything in those quiet “run the brain’s existential dread garbage collection routine” moments.
Self aware consciousness is just so wild. Like you say, how does it even exist? But it’s also so common on our little planet here (even if we only count the humans) that it is as commonplace as it is spectacular.
It feels like this magical “extra” thing, but at the same time the evidence kinda suggests it’s just something that naturally happens once you get complex life.
The weirdest thing to me is that it’s literally impossible to measure and detect whether something has consciousness. Every other thing in our universe can be measured theoretically, even if not by our current tools, but there is no way to confirm that someone else is experiencing what I am experiencing currently. It’s just so weird.
You might find some answers in Julian Jaynes The origin of consciousness in the breakdown of the bicameral mind.
Short version: consciousness is kind of new. We aren’t really good at it.
Also, Why Buddhism is True by Robert Wright is very good. Less about Buddhism more about how we think and why it works.
I was really curious to check out that first book after your short version.
But damn, the subject matter of that second book might draw my attention first. The Buddhist approach & techniques made so much sense to me in a completely pragmatic way.
I might have to order myself physical copies of both of these to read outside by my koi pond on cool fall days. The fact that the whole scene will be so on the nose to the point of being cliched will just amuse me further, lol.
Thanks for the recommendations!
Edit: oh jesus christ there’s a koi on the cover of Why Buddhism is True, haha. Looks like I should invest in the hardcover.
I got a lot out of Wright’s book and I continue to revisit it.
It is a slow read that demands your attention, but it is very enlightening.
I will keep that in mind. I look forward to taking my time with it. Thank you again!
I ordered the other book too, but Wright’s book here has definitely jumped to the front of the line.
I think it’s important to point out that the bicameral mind is one theory, but that doesn’t necessarily mean it’s true. One of its major criticisms is that it suggests consciousness only arose in humans around the time we started writing about it, and that it didn’t exist in humans before then. It’s also entirely possible that humans were conscious way before that, but when we started writing about it was just when we developed the cultural concept of what consciousness is.
The theory also seems to imply there is something special about human metacognitive processes compared to other animals, which would therefore imply that animals are not conscious. That seems weirdly reductive when various non-human animals show some evidence of self-awareness (mirror spot test, Alex the grey parrot).
It’s a nice theory which ties lots of things together, but it’s no more true than any other theory of consciousness at the moment.
Correct. In the case of the question, I believe there is value to be gained, even if there are flaws in the argument.
You are the construct of a million cells, an evolutionary “trick” that allows all the pieces to act as one. Your task is to percieve your environment and survive in it.
Sure, I get the biology and technical aspect of it and I can understand that something could evolve whose atoms would move in such a way that it results in an object that is capable of responding dynamically to its roundings, plan and think. But for that collection of atoms to then result in this experience, I feel is extraordinarily exceptional.
That’s precisely the scary part. A nothingness, for all of eternity. It ends, never to continue. I do not know what it is like. Just… not seeing. Not hearing. None of the senses, and no thoughts either. No consciousness.
I wouldn’t be scared after dead, cuz I’dn’t have the consciousness for that. However, being alive, I can. I can fear the eternal nothingness of inexistence
I think this may or may not have some connection to a post from that monkey in the brain guy who also has a TED Talk (Tim Something?). I recall seeing a post of his about life or something. Talked about how short our lives are in the grand scheme of things. Had even an image with days or weeks or months of life, like a progress bar
On the other hand, reading that people actually close to death don’t worry as much as people imagining being close to death, iirc, may have had a positive impact in my fear. Though I recalln’t well
Dear brother/sister rest your mind. You cannot control what will happen and worry/fear will only agitate you.
I don’t like the idea of life being over, but it is inevitable. Seek acceptance and peace with this so you do not waste your precious hours with unnecessary discomfort. There is so much more to enjoy while we are still here!
Loss of life is followed by mourning - except when it is our own. Some spend decades mourning the end of their lives because they are scared of facing it down. You’ve done the big scary part already. Now spend the time taking yourself through all of your fears. Once you come to acceptance it doesn’t change what will be, but it will trouble you a lot less.
Well, there technically may not be an eternity. Universe is 14 billion years old now…in 32 trillion years or so the last black holes and last particles will cease to exist. Time will no longer have any meaning, and the nothingness will be all there is.
What a shit hand we were dealt.
