Why in the world did Sun make such business decisions that it killed itself?
FFS, instead of open sourcing this and that, and banking on high-end servers, they could have at least tried at desktops.
If anybody remembers what Sun’s perception was in 2003, they could have been selling desktop machines for Apple prices and nobody would bat an eye.
If Sun were still alive, this wouldn’t happen. I think.
EDIT:
LOL, I’ve just stumbled upon another Bill Joy’s interview where he too says that Sun should have gone the consumer way as a priority.
Just imagine having a Solaris PC in year 2024, that is, now. ZFS with snapshots, Zones, and as easy to maintain as OpenBSD while insanely functional. Probably SPARC hardware without Intel bullshit.
And I like to think that Java applets would still be a thing, instead of HTML5 and stuff, with security problems solved and a more elegant Web.
Wasn’t sun bought by orcale not kill itself?
Almost the same.
Murder rather than suicide, but dead is dead.
I still can’t believe that so many PCs are getting cut off from software updates. Its going to be a huge security issue. There will suddenly be millions of unsecured computers being actively used. I can imagine that this will be allowed to happen.
I think Microsoft is doing this because they want to make the ultimate spy network with copilot or what ever they are calling it now. I really need to figure out how to get a single work app to work on Linux reliably. I use it for like 99% of my work, so a virtual machine is kind of useless. I honestly think I will need to wait for a native version of the app to be developed and who knows if that will happen.
MS: I want to make Windows 11 require motherboard features that make ransomware attacks more difficult so I can say it’s more secure, even though it’s merely a feature of the motherboard.
Also MS: Sadly, if your tech doesn’t have these features you cannot upgrade and it will be insecure because I will not make updates for it.
Are you talking about TPM 2? Because I don’t think that makes classic ransomware more difficult. Also it doesn’t have to be strictly a motherboard feature, e.g mine comes without a fixed hardware TPM, but my processor supports fTPM, which has up- and downsides. But it works as a TPM.
Also MS: Sadly, if your tech doesn’t have these features you cannot upgrade and it will be insecure because I will not make updates for it.
Technically, this isn’t true, MS will continue to update Windows 10 and even individual users can receive these officially through the Windows 10 ESU program: https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/whats-new/extended-security-updates
Not that I’m in favor of what they’re doing, I think they should rather support older hardware with Win 11 and require modern features only on modern systems. But from a security standpoint, their decision is actually good, as it builds a secure foundation. Most private users will just do whatever on that foundation (e.g. run random stuff from the Internet), but I think going forward, this is the right choice, though probably for the wrong reason of doing Intel a favor.
SecureBoot.
I really need to figure out how to get a single work app to work on Linux reliably
what work app?
I use it for like 99% of my work, so a virtual machine is kind of useless
i mean, it depends on your computer (like if your cpu & motherboard supports virtualization) but you can in theory get a VM with pretty decent performance
on my m1 macbook i have a windows VM that runs very smoothly and i can effortlessly use a gesture on the touchpad to switch between them. it’s pretty cool
on linux it’s a little harder to set up (i had to pay like $100 for the software on the mac) but it’s doable
Micro$oft doesn’t understand that these full-screen new Win11 PCs are actually Linux ads!
I have started switching my parents. Last year before all this really started getting crazy and I bought my mother a used HP elitebook laptop and set her up with Linux on it. Just to get her to test it out and use it. And replace her older laptops. There’s very little she does that actually depends on windows. Everything tends to be in the browser. There was only one odd application that’s odd even under windows. But it has an Android version that I got running with waydroid.
In the last month and I got my father a new used office PC that was about 10 Generations newer than what he had processor-wise. And set it up with Linux out of the box. He’s been enjoying using it it’s so much faster snappier and less spammy. And here this month when I have time. Getting my mother’s desktop PC converted over to dual boot at least with Linux as primary. I’ve had far fewer tech support issues since I’ve done it too.
Between system 76, framework, tuxedo, and a few other sellers. There are actually a few options now offering Linux out of the box. Next time I buy a PC it will likely be from one of them depending upon what I’m looking for. And if anyone asked me for recommendations they will be the only ones I will recommend. Apart from ordering used office machines and repurposing them LOL. Unless you want to do current gym Triple A games at 4K etc. You can get six generation i7 systems for around $100 and use graphic cards for 50 to 100. And play most games and have a great time. It’s actually kind of hilarious I have a couple of Verizon systems from the last 4 to 5 years. The system I spend more time on is a 6th generation i7 Lenovo business Tower. Largely because it’s running Linux and the others are running Windows.
I am concerned that most users won’t understand that either
They won’t. The vast majority of consumers aren’t even aware Linux exists.
I’m praising Valve right now for all the work they’ve put into Proton.
95% of my games work on Linux. Quite a few windows specific programs too. Praise proton and the wine team!
Examples of Windows programs that work via proton?
One very specific 3d printer program, greetings workshop (my mom had the program back in the day and she likes getting cards from it), Starcraft1 and Starcraft2 (works pretty well!), some contract specific programs. Theres a couple of others I have hooked up, but you get the idea.
If it doesn’t work the first time, I usually go on https://appdb.winehq.org/ or the proton specific one and take a look.
Okay yeah I knew about protondb but haven’t got wine figured out or heard of that winehq.
Thanks!
Yes, because of Proton, I’m seriously considering dumping Microsoft now. My big holdup was my library of Steam games. I just found out about Proton a couple of weeks ago, and as it turns out, most of my games are pretty compatible.
If most of your games are on Steam, it makes the transition super smooth (with only a few exceptions I’ve had so far, and none that I’ve been unable to get working with a bit of tinkering)
My game library was what was holding me back too. Now I just have to see if animationdesk runs on linux and I’ll be all set make the switch.
If it doesn’t I don’t know what I’ll do. I haven’t found any other animation programs built primarily around onion skinning. I don’t need AI to create the tweens for me. I just want a bare bones program that let’s me do everything by hand.
I’ll have to check when I get out of work today and if it’s all good I’ll probably start researching installation processes this weekend. I don’t know much about Linux, but I guess I’m about to learn
You could run a windows vm on linux :)
Do it! I just made the switch (using PopOS as my distro, AMD CPU, 1080ti GPU) and haven’t had much trouble with my extensive Steam collection. The biggest issue so far was Bioshock Infinite which actually runs native and I had to edit some configs for texture pools. SteamVR / Index has been a little unstable but seems to generally work (I don’t use it enough to be sure if it’s Linux or my hardware getting old).
SteamDB has been a excellent resource for checking compatibility and game specific tweaks.
Civ6 also has issues with the Linux version due to Aspyr slacking. A bunch of the newer content hasn’t been ported yet. Fortunately, you can force Steam to install the Windows version and run it with Proton.
I made the switch and never looked back.
Only thing it cost me was recently Apex Legends but I can deal.
LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX LINUX
Holy crap it’s a full-page ad!
Btw.
Bro you literally spammed Linux on my other older posts. Stop it
You’ll figure it out.
Cool. Since you believe they’ll figure it out, I guess that means you don’t have to spam.
Hey I remember you from that other post where you also spammed LINUX. :p
This whole Win 11 mess is what finally convinced me to switch. I still can’t get over that Settings hasn’t reached feature parity with Control Panel yet. Figured if I have to re-learn how to do settings for the 10th time, I might as well do it in an OS that isn’t shoving ads in my face.
I was simply trying to format a disk and so searched in the start bar expecting a suitable control panel item to pop up any would have happened in any sane era of windows. Instead fucking bing opened and it brought me back web results for “format disk” as well as unrelated ads. fucking web results!
gargh
Try Fedora! I find it it just works out of the box and the little I don’t know I can Google, tho im Linux newby myself
I think for people who like Out-Of-The-Box, Fedora is ideal. It’s the only OS I didn’t have to troubleshoot the Bluetooth immediately.
I put it on my grandmothers computer and she hasn’t had any major complaints in 2 years 🤞
Windows 10 LTSC currently has an EoL date of 2027-01-12.
No store, no cortana, much less bullshit in general.
LTSC is the only current windows version I even remotely consider having.Windows 10 LTSC (Long-Term Servicing Channel) is a specialized version of Windows 10 that’s all about reliability and stability. It’s tailored for specific use cases like medical devices, ATMs, industrial systems, and other environments where updates could mess with critical operations.
Key Points About Windows 10 LTSC: Minimal Updates: LTSC skips the frequent feature updates you see with regular Windows 10 and sticks to just security updates and critical fixes. Each version gets 10 years of support—5 years mainstream and 5 years extended. Stripped-Down Version: This version ditches all the extra stuff like Cortana, the Microsoft Store, Edge, and bundled games, making it lightweight and focused. Stability Above All: It’s designed to be rock-solid and isn’t about chasing the latest features. Release Schedule: New LTSC versions come out every 2-3 years, tied to specific Windows 10 feature updates (like Windows 10 LTSC 2021). Who It’s For: It’s for specialized devices and setups where you can’t afford sudden changes. It’s not something you’d typically use on your daily home or work PC. How You Get It: LTSC is available through volume licensing and is really meant for businesses and enterprises. Misconceptions: It’s not for regular use, like avoiding updates or keeping things ultra-simple on a personal PC. It doesn’t support a lot of modern hardware and features, so unless you have a very specific need, you’re better off sticking with the regular versions of Windows 10.
If you’re thinking about LTSC, make sure it actually fits what you’re trying to do—its limitations could end up being a headache if you’re not using it in the right way.
Funny, when I think of Windows, reliability and stability are the last things on my mind. I mean, if they could build a reliable release then why isn’t that shipped with all computers? You know, like with linux, the stable version is also the current release. Basically your description makes it sound like what’s really making Windows so unreliable is all the crapware that Microsoft forces down your throat.
Yes, exactly, because it’s all that crapware and bloatware that makes you inadvertently sign up for wholly unnecessary subscriptions to crap Services that nobody needs or wants. Plus all the advertisements. Lennox would seem to be a far better solution for a point of sale system or inventory management system or something like that
Sounds like a great sales pitch… “PoS machines, but unlike Windows-based devices ours continue to work after the first six months!”
Wait…Wait a minute… What about…MCDONALD’S ICE CREAM MACHINES!!!
If they switched to linux the ice cream would be colder and even smoother.
And if you use IoT LTSC, its even more lean
Paying Microsoft more money so they can give you less Windows is a very Microsoft thing to do.
deleted by creator
Suit yourself, I don’t trust Windows already so, adding a third-party to that process doesn’t intrigue me in the slightest.
Yeah, I’m with you there. Don’t pirate an OS. That is just asking for shit to go wrong.
Always, always, always get OS images from the first party or first-party identified mirror.
I stopped paying Microsoft a long time ago.
I hate how microsoft seems to think they own the term PC now and it can mean anything they want. Some of the “Copilot+ PCs” they’re advertising on things like this have ARM CPUs which means they aren’t PCs. I would even argue that a lot of x86 computers aren’t PCs now because they only support UEFI booting so aren’t PC compatible. They need to just call them computers or come up with a new term
Doesn’t PC just mean personal computer though?
Yes, but ironically the PC was a reaction to the more authoritarian IBM server/terminal model. The PC was really about owning and being able to hack your own shit. It seems like cloud+device lockdown is just reinventing servers and terminals…
I mean, they’re not called International Personal Machines, are they? The server-terminal system worked well for a large organisation, and it’s not far away from how many companies still do things.
have ARM CPUs which means they aren’t PCs
Why on earth would architecture have anything to do with it?
only support UEFI booting so aren’t PC compatible.
Oh wow, I don’t think anyone using the term “PC” this century was referring to “IBM PC-Compatible” like it’s 1981. The only vestages of that is that the term excludes Mac even today.
They may not have realized it, but until UEFI-only computers started becoming common, people mostly were still effectively drawing the line at IBM compatibility
What’s the fundamental difference between an Intel Macbook and my old 2018 Lenovo laptop? Either of them can run modern Windows, Linux, whatever. For most modern uses, they’re basically equivalent. The one thing that makes the Lenovo different though is its firmware. The Lenovo has BIOS support and the Mac doesn’t.
If you then add my current Framework laptop, which is UEFI-only, to the comparison though, it gets kind of fuzzy. It’s clearly not a Mac, but what is there to really define it as a PC? It can’t run MacOS, but that doesn’t really work to separate it because plenty of PCs can run MacOS. It’s not made by Apple, but if that’s all it takes then is a Chromebook or one of the Talos POWER workstations a PC too? It’s kind of hard to say the Framework is a PC without including so many other things that the term PC kind of loses all meaning.
I think the term PC has just outlived its usefulness and we need to move on to saying more specific things than that to describe computers. In most modern contexts, all that matters is what architecture a computer is and what operating systems will run on it, and PC just isn’t really a great term to convey that information anymore.
PC = a computer that you use to do computer stuff on. Windows PC, Linux PC, MacBook or a Chromebook, it’s all PC.
Yup, I go out of my way to call any personal computer a PC. For example:
- Macbook Pro PC running macOS for work
- Thinkpad PC running Linux at home
- desktop PC running Linux for gaming
- desktop PC running Linux as a NAS
- handheld PC running GrapheneOS for a phone
- handheld PC running SteamOS for gaming
- wearable PC running WearOS as a watch
They’re all PCs, because I can run whatever I want on them. My Switch isn’t a PC because I can’t run whatever I want, but everything else in that list absolutely is. Yeah, I get weird looks sometimes, but I’m stubborn.
NO
Microsoft sucks, but surely they have to know that already
They’ve been doing that with intel for ages, one build a slower OS the other a faster processor.
I bet they’re gonna have to do what car dealerships do… Yeah bring your old iPad for trade in!.. Okay I don’t see my trade in discount though…it’s right there! Look in the small font, it’s $5.56 we compared against Kelly’s cousin’s purple book of laptops.
That kinda did the trick for me since my old PC was starting to struggle with some tasks, so I went and built a new PC recently.
Joke’s on Microsoft though, I installed Arch Linux on it instead. It’s so much less work to maintain compared to Windows these days.
A relative of mine had also got fed up with the Windows BS and was interested in what I was running, so I got her machine dual booted with Debian now to try it out. She hasn’t looked back either, so that to me proves that Linux is ready for non-techies.
My GF is not technical and had an old, old laptop that barely ran, so I gave her an Ubuntu USB drive and helped her boot from it, but she did the install all on her own. She even fixed a printer driver issue by doing some research and installing an updated driver.
But that just goes to show that Linux isn’t exactly hard if you know how to read.
I can only hope that nothing ever happens to where I’d have to use Windows again. (been using only linux for over 10 years and the latest Windows I ever used was win 7 at work).
If that happened, the shock of all the last 10-15 years’ accumulation of enshittification hitting me at once might give me a stroke. The boiling frogs of today have gotten used to their OS serving them ads and spying on them by now, but I wouldn’t be able to deal with it.
I dual boot at work, which in practice means I have a Linux laptop with a Windows partition for occasional use.
It’s windows 10, not 11, and the machine has decent specs: 6c/12t, 32 GB ram, and an SSD. Windows feels legitimately clunky and slow to me when I use it, and I am not using some lightweight Linux distro meant to be blazing fast. I run Mint Cinnamon which is as mainstream and all-in-one as it gets. But it still feels like it was created to serve the user rather than third party business interests.
I have some desktop machines at home that run windows 10 as well, which I use pretty infrequently. One of my winter projects is going to be fixing that. The OS part anyway.
Exactly the same setup and experience here. Work forces me to use an inferior application in windows instead of a more powerful option in Linux and it boils my blood.
Any chance you could use that Windows app in a VM, or is Windows itself a mandate too?
Before we got the green light to dual boot, I spent 90% of my time using Linux in a VM while windows basically handled my M365 applications. These days I much prefer having Teams and Outlook being tabs in Firefox!
I don’t think so, this is rather complex video editing software and I never heard about anyone running it in a VM. Maybe I’ll give it a try someday.
Has anybody found a way to turn Microsoft’s ads off yet? I’m tired of dismissing their prompts to switch to Edge and Office 365 every few months.
I run a local account and toggled off all the telemetry stuff during installation nine years ago. Never saw one of those. Didn’t even get toggled on with updates. Only problem I had was Copilot getting added a few weeks ago. By that time, Win10 had become the compatibility fallback for Linux, though.
So, create a local account, go into Settings, and toggle off everything that could maybe be telemetry related.
O&O Shutup for Windows is also a solid tool for disabling telemetry and bloat. They have a recommended set of options to flip, all of which can be flipped at once, which is real damn convenient.
Yes, but you won’t like to hear it…
I installed Linux one time and now im a cat girl
Go on….
Don’t listen to them, I installed Linux multiple times and I‘m still a fat nerd
…go on…
Who said a cat girl cant be a fat nerd
sigh
gets his Ventoy USB drive ready for a new ISO…
As an experiment I revoked the certificate that is used for code verification on the executable responsible for the popups. So far the only thing I broke was the .net installer. But no more pop-ups. :D
Yes. Go buy a new computer.
Then give me your old computer so I can put linux on it and distribute it for free to students and immigrants.
I like how almost everything we do now is in response to things going to shit.
Lemmy - Reddit went to shit
Linux (Desktop, anyway) - Windows went to shit
Piracy - Distribution and pricing went to shit
Jellyfin - Plex went to shit
Emulation - Nintendo, mostly…
Matrix - Just in case Signal tries anything… switchblade
Monopoly was originally the Landlord’s Game and was designed to teach children the dangers of unchecked monopolies and growth in the concentration of wealth.
Software and by extension, software companies are subject to those same Iron Laws of Oligarchy.
Given enough time, everything turns to shit, and it’s up to younger, healthy, energized people to fight back the power creep.
Please don’t give your computers to Elon musk he doesn’t need them.
Got that the other day on my gaming computer. Very irritating.
Especially since I bought the computer in 2021 specifically to run the virtual cycling program Zwift. I’m not replacing it just to placate Microsoft. It’s more than powerful enough to run Zwift and will be for years. I’m hoping the options for using Zwift on Linux pan out.
It looks like the authors themselves are also interested!
https://zwiftinsider.com/zwift-on-linux/
This is interesting, I might give the application a try myself
Zwiftinsider isn’t run by Zwift - he just reports on them (though he definitely has inside information, and they work with him on various things, like letting him use “bots” to test various functionalities).
That is pretty old. I think there are several approaches now. The one he lists, one using docker (I actually had it running on my desktop Linux machine, but I didn’t actually test it), and I think some people got it working under WINE.
Zwift’s saving grace is that you can connect most hardware via your phone - trainer, cadence, heart rate monitor, etc. - because it’s designed to also run on things like Apple TVs, iPads, and Android phones and tablets, albeit with probably lower graphics settings. So, you don’t need to worry about the hardware end of it (ANT+ dongle), which very much simplifies the issue. Which reminds me, my heart rate monitor is ANT+ only, and I’d need a bluetooth-capable one to do this.
(Also, at worst, I could run it on my tablet and hook that up to a monitor, so even if I can’t get it running on Linux, I still have options.)
Maybe it is time for a new LINUX PC.
Or a new Linux install on your existing PC.
