Found this notification this morning on my pixel 6.
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Deactivate from settings Have https always on, protection against tracking on strict, data collection and daily ping on off.
And that’s it.
So if Mozilla wants to monetize location data, what does this mean for all the custom ROMs that use Mozilla’s location provider instead of Google’s?
This might mean that we would have no true free location provider left.
Fork it, split it off, share it.
wait, mozilla has a location provider? maybe there is open street map, idk what’s the difference between a map and a location provider
Nah, open street maps is part of an open source map initiative with Meta and Microsoft, we’re safe there…
My (probably incomplete) understanding is: phones have a GNSS chip (such as GPS, Galileo, or Glonass), but getting location from that takes a long time and a lot of battery. So they estimate location based on other information such as what cell tower they are connected to and the list of available wi-fi networks. This requires a database with all that info, which Google built through its Street View cars.
So the location provider is a service to which your phone sends all the info it has and which replies with an estimate of your location; which means it handles a lot of sensitive data.
ooh does openstreetmap have a location viewer? it would be better for privacy than mozzila and google
So if Mozilla wants to monetize location data, what does this mean for all the custom ROMs that use Mozilla’s location provider instead of Google’s?
Nothing, because they dont sell location data, this just seems like a routine warning that pops up when ToS and Privacy policy changes, and since they have clarified their position on this matter, (not to mention the lack of alternative FOSS web engines). We really shouldn’t let this bother us
Of course i might be wrong and it may come out that Mozilla has turned heel(lot of heel turning happening lately)
No custom ROM use MLS anymore. It was shut down a few years ago.
Anyway, in general, apps get their location data from Play Services.
Apps that don’t use Play Services get data from the default provider, which is always Google.
The successor of MLS is BeaconDB.
As of the latest Chrome update on PC, they have dropped support for uBlock. You can still technically enable it, but they disabled it by default once you update.
That got me back to Firefox with breakneck speed.
Frankly speaking, calling out Google and Chrome, then moving to Firefox while Mozilla have been doing it’s best Google impression for years now is not that great of a plan.
I wonder how long Firefox will be ok with all that, since Mozilla bought that advertisement business a while ago.
The main problem is that building a web browser is extremely difficult and everyone else uses Google’s version of WebKit. So there’s no alternatives: it’s either Google or Mozilla. Forks don’t count because if some functionality that end users need is deprecated, nobody will maintain it and it will just disappear once it’s removed from the main codebase
building a web browser is extremely difficult and everyone else uses Google’s version of WebKit
To be fair it is based on KHTML. One of projects KDE can spend that extra money on and resurrect.
Bring back Konqueror too while at it!
Edit: Apparently it still exists, it just isn’t the default on any mainstream distros anymore
Saying KHTML = WebKit is like saying a sponge is a killer whale.
Yes, I agree. That’s why I’m weirded out by people saying “Firefox bad, use Librewolf” and the like.
I still think a solution that relies on donation (maybe with some corporate support) would be very good for everyone involved. Unfortunately, Mozilla is not a player in this, so we’re stuck with basically three engines, one that can’t be used, one that’s openly hostile, and one that’s becoming hostile.
Not great.
You just described Servo. It will happen. The Linux Foundation is backing it up now… after Mozilla dropped it.
Servo
Hm. Did not know about that. Interesting, thanks.
Hopefully Servo will change that
Hopefully soon Librewolf, Fennec F-droid and other forks will become mainstream.
I haven’t switched to Librewolf on pc yet; hoping that turning off the telemetry/etc options in ff is enough, but I’m starting to think it might not be long.
I was that same way with Firefox for a while, but after I gave Librewolf a long-term test drive I stuck with it.
If you’re used to Firefox with the privacy stuff cranked up, from a user perspective Librewolf is basically just that. But I like knowing that some of the Mozilla stuff is actually removed.
They also roll out updates quickly. I’m pretty sure I updated Firefox and Librewolf to 136.0.1 today just hours apart.
I want to switch over further but so far I’ve had so much else going on that data privacy hasn’t taken a priority. Things are getting weird now so it is time for a priority change.
I switched over to LibreWolf recently. I discovered Vivaldi just a few hours before I learned about the Manifest v3 stuff for Chromium (which is a shame because I actually LOVED Vivaldi). I really want to try Zen Browser, but I’m using old, 2011-era Macs (running Ubuntu 24.04 on one) and it won’t install. LibreWolf is great because of its clean, minimal design and absolute privacy-forward thinking. I’ve enjoyed it so far (and I’m only running it on the Ubuntu machine).
You know what they say about people who live in glass houses…
Don’t advertise others’ locations?
Fennec is great on Android
I’ve been pretty happy with it as my casual web search browser, putting all my social media on a different browser. And it’s in F-Droid, so that always feels good.
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i mean it’s just because you can grant websites location data and toggle telemetry.
Well, there seem to be some good safe alternatives. I am currently switching from Firefox to Vivaldi, for example.
Isn’t Vivaldi a chromium browser?
Hmm I didn’t know that. I was looking for more data privacy. However, there seem to be good alternatives.
Been using Libre Wolf, no issues so far. Fuck Firefox
Librewolf is Firefox plus some light patches, and as such depends entirely from Firefox.
It looks like they have a team and it’s open-source. It’s a gamble, but I’m guessing the death of Firefox would probably be a boon, not a hinderance, depending on who supports what from there.
Does libre wolf have an android app?
Fennec but I think it still shares some data
Thanks for that
IronFox is the closest alternative. F-Droid repo here:
Dead link 😢
Do you have F-Droid installed? Not to pull a docker, but it is opening for me on 2 separate devices.
Firefox engines have telemetry since old ages. Do you know what even crazier ??? even other firefox browser like fennec has Mozilla telemetry.
PSA : disable it with Blocker (ROOT) for more privacyFor a novice, what exactly is Blocker (ROOT)? Is it an app, a setting, or a configuration?
Its app that you can downloaded in F-Droid, basically it’s a app that can control other app components. But before that you must Root/Unlock bootloader
It has a mozilla telemetry component, but that doesn’t mean that it’s necessarily reporting to mozilla - which wouldn’t make much sense anyway - nor that it actually functions at all. Most telemetry components in Firefox can’t simply be deleted because it causes stuff to break, so they are replaced with stubs that don’t actually do anything.
Assuming that’s all it’s really doing.
Sending telemetry like crashes and what features you use/don’t use isn’t really in the same category as using location data for marketing purposes. It’s a very important distinction to draw.
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“Quick! Jump to chrome instead!” - Google spokesperson
Fanboys of Firefox: “DUHB DUHB USE FIREFOX CUZ IT NOT CHROME DUHB DUHB!”
Genuine question to see if the downvotes are justified or not : are you implying Chrome is a good browser and if so, why?
Down votes are justified for acting like a douche
The downvotes are idiotic fanboys who faithfully clutch Firefox like rosary beads because it isn’t chrome.
Why the fuck would anyone imply that I think Chrome is any better? It only tells me they’re fucking morons.
An alternative explanation is that the trolling style of your post is attracting downvotes.
I’m going to assume you’re one of the downvoters and anyone else in this chain. I’m going to now auto-block. Bye.
(What’s funny is that I went for writing an actual reply and did not downvote).
I think AugustWest’s point kinda got proven just now.
Take your meds, you’re spiraling
ooh do me next!
A more succinct explanation is that they are just an asshole.
That’s indeed a natural conclusion about the kind of person who writes a post like that, but I didn’t want to rule out other explanations such as drug consumption or stupidity.
I personally don’t want there to be only one browser engine - Chrome. All other browsers use their engine, or the one powering Firefox. That’s actually my main concern. I don’t know about you, but Chromium being the only web browser in the world is pretty fuckin scary.
Where did I ever say or imply that Chrome is the only option? A lot of you just misinterpret me on purpose, downvote parade galore just to stomp all over someone to make yourselves feel good about it. God, people really are this fucking stupid.
Just use chrome man, that will really take the fight to the next level
Friendship ended with Firefox. Waterfox is my new best friend ❤️
IceCat.
Unfortunately I am primarily an android user, as I always have my phone with me.
I shall give it a go for desktop at some point though
Ironfox seems to work well on Android.
Many Linux distributions will need to dig Firefox looks like . I use Fennec btw , and in desktop Libre wolf since a long time.
I don’t use default firefox for this damn reason… I hope that Mull Fork gets going soon… I’ve been in refuge in IceRaven since that time…
Ironfox?
That’s a regular notification, which would happen for any application whose data policy is changed on the Play Store page. These policy are as declared by the app publisher. This would be the same for any application that didn’t check that “sharing data with third party” box earlier, then checked it later on.
I don’t get what your comment is getting at. I don’t view this post as saying anything special or unique about the notification. I see it as a warning that Firefox is now doing this.
The legal definition of “sell” has changed in several major markets, and that’s (supposedly) why Firefox has recently changed their terms. The word “sell” is now ostensibly broad enough to include “give to anybody for any reason”, including if you use Firefox for any reason where you would legitimately want and need Firefox to give (“sell”) your data - for example if you use it for: literally any shopping or even just browsing store pages; any interactive (real world) maps where you may want to use your location; any searches where you want local businesses to be listed; any search engine that may want to use your location to aid in results; etc. etc. etc.
Any legitimate exchange of data can now be construed as “selling” because of the new legal definitions, regardless of if anyone is actually selling anything.
It’s very possible that nothing has changed - that Firefox hasn’t started selling user data, they’re just updating their terms (and this app listing) to reflect the changes in the legal definitions of “sell”.
The whole “legal definitions are why we changed” is definitely what they’re rolling with, but I don’t think a lot of what you said is correct. Websites selling data is not the same as firefox selling data. If a site sells your data while you’re using firefox, that is in no way shape or form involved with firefox. That’s also not what they are claiming. They are strictly talking about the data that firefox directly collects and distributes. It would include search results if you searched via the address bar, I suppose. They have sold data for a while, but it’s anonymized (https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/sponsor-privacy).
Firefox is free to use, but it costs a lot of money to develop. They need money, nobody here is denying that. Many users on this platform have tried to avoid any form of data collection as much as possible (myself included) so they would rather pay to fund it (though many don’t). However, most people would rather pay for the service with ads and data collection. Because to them, it’s basically free. Most users would never even consider moving to Firefox if it was paid. They could offer two options, one paid and one “free”, but they haven’t done that yet and it’s not clear if they plan to.
Most importantly, it’s really about being transparent. If they need money, they shouldn’t try to hide the fact they are selling anonymized data by saying “We never sell you data” or to be like “oh no, we are doing it because of legal definitions” when in reality they are selling data. I get it’s a PR movement, but most of the people intentionally using Firefox are tech savvy people wanting to get away from Google’s big brother approach. I get people defending Firefox, and I also get people hating on Mozilla, but we should also be clear about the reality. Firefox is, and has been selling your data (in some form), but now the laws are changing to make it more clear that what they’re doing is in fact selling data.
Which parts do you disagree with? I’m not talking about websites selling your data after you access them through Firefox, I’m saying that now - with new definitions of “sale”/“sell” - that Firefox giving anybody any data for almost any reason can be legally construed as “selling”. This isn’t just the case for Firefox, it’s the case for literally any web browser, and anything that can access the internet for any reason.
Yes, I thought about including the fact that Firefox does engage in ad-based revenue, and I suppose I should’ve, but Firefox is pretty upfront about this and allows users to opt out of targeted advertising - and this has been the case since long before this past week or two. These ads only appear on the “new tab” page, and only if you consent to seeing them. Anybody who’s dropping Firefox for this recent controversy seens to be missing that. It’s very possible (and personally I think it’s likely) that nothing at all has changed from within Firefox.
Have you read all the other replies? “Google mad”, “Google putting Firefox in the dirt”, “False info”, etc.
I interpret top level comments as responses to OP unless they say something otherwise.
