I really don’t like the design of the progress pride flag, and I couldn’t really put my finger on it until I saw this: https://nava.org/good-flag-bad-flag
For reference, here is the flag I’m referencing as “bad flag”:
And here is the original:
So, the original has too many colors, but it’s the colors of the rainbow. In order. It’s recognizable from really far away, and it’s dead simple to draw.
With the Intersex flag, that’s 14 colors. There are three shades of “purple”. The circle won’t be visible from far away. The chevrons are too thin to be very recognizable from far away.
It’s not like there aren’t good pride flags. Like there are AMAZING ones:
Edit:
In case you don’t know what these are: https://flagsforgood.com/collections/pride-flags
The progress flag is copyrighted by one Daniel Quasar, and he sporadically exercises his copyright on people who use the sell designs involving the progress flag. Or so I’ve heard. Anyway, for this reason, I avoid using it.
The primary reason it’s copyrighted is to prevent corporations from profiting off of it.
i was sceptical of this claim but it appears you’re dead right
Most people do not know about this flag’s origins. Its creator appropriated Gilbert Baker’s 1978 rainbow flag and the light blue, pink, and white stripes from the 1999 trans pride flag created by Monica Helms (without even a call to her), and the black and brown stripes from the 2017 More Colors More Pride Flag designed in partnership with Philadelphia’s Office of LGBT Affairs and then proceeded to LICENSE THE DESIGN FOR PROFIT
https://gaycitynews.com/we-need-walk-away-progress-profit-flag/
rest of the article is interesting too
this just makes it all the more baffling that this graphic-design-is-my-passion gaudy clashing mess of a flag is the one you see everywhere now
That’s wild. I would have retained the copyright too, but for the purpose of suing the fuck out of people who misuse it
Even if that were what he’s doing, I would still avoid using it as I’m a supporter of the public domain on principle. If something is essentially public domain, it should be fully public domain.
Ugly flags & the LGBT+ community, name a more iconic duo. Like, I thought we had designers amongst us, whatever happened to them?
But you see, Graphic Design is their passion!
it’s a long time meme that pretty much all LGBT flags are awfully designed. but they also got wide acceptance so it’s hard to redesign. as a designer I’ve looked for redesigns and have not seen anything really. even the ones you’ve shared are brand new to me. where did you find those?
I’m of the option that the original rainbow flag is still the best. It was meant to include everyone under the rainbow so trans people and others are already included.
The Progress flag stands for the progress that has been made and the progress that STILL NEEDS TO BE MADE against racism and transphobia as well as memorializing those we lost to AIDS.
So yes, while the original flag is meant to include all the LGBT+ communities, progress stands for more than inclusion for a lot of us ✌️
My problems with the progress flag and the trans rainbow flag are not with the groups or ideas they are ment to express.
First like OP I think they are bad flag designs. To busy and lack the simple design a flag should have. I also just don’t like the look.
Second there is value in a consistent recognizable design like the rainbow. I spot all sorts of variants and often don’t know what they are supposed to mean.
I also don’t think there should be spefic meaning to the parts. Saying this color stripe is this group and that color is another group is problematic.
The rainbow colors were meant to symbolize broad inclusion. Everybody under the rainbow. Red isn’t gay, blue isn’t lesbian, etc. (I know some have tried to add that after the fact).
When you start adding spefic groups to the flag you start having included groups and excluded groups. So as much as I support trans rights and think they belong in the community I don’t want any spefic group in the flag.
You then get groups that are not included and want a new flag to included them. Like we are seeing with the trans flag causing groups to want the progress flag. Pretty soon the rainbow is going to look like nascar with logos everywhere.
A simple consistent flag with the message of broad inclusion is better.
I think you’re missing the forest for the trees and I don’t think I’ll be engaging with your slippery slope argument ✌️
Was it meant to represent black and indigenous people?
Does it need to?
Not sure why you would ask that. I’m responding to this claim:
It was meant to include everyone under the rainbow so trans people and others are already included.
Ah I get your point. Native and black people are their own sexual identity. Got it.
What annoys me about takes like this is that it seems to be appealing to some sort of council of gays who are in charge of the flags. Nobody is. There’s no “official” flag. If you don’t like the progress flag or the intersex version of it then just don’t fly them or design your own that you do like. Nobody is stopping you. A ton of the pride flags in use today are just designed by random Tumblr users in the mid '10s. Which is fine, not hating on them, just making sure you know there is nothing stopping you from making one you like or flying the ones you prefer.
This is the very reason I’m surprised. These flags come and go by the winds of memetics; so why is it that this design is somehow able to propagate so well despite being so clearly visually incoherent?
I’m not necessarily complaining, I’m just astonished that it caught on. Like imagine if a really discordant and structureless song became super popular.
I fly the original pride progress flag on my house and I really like it. If it is shocking to you that not everyone agrees with what makes a flag look good look no further than the US’s state flags. They’re a mess. They’re all over the place. People have different tastes. I think the “state seal on blue background” is bad but clearly enough people in those places don’t dislike it enough to change it.
pride flag indeed.
That’s not actually the original pride flag. That’s the one with 2 mission stripes that were taken away due to cost. The original had turquoise instead of blue and a pink and indigo stripe, so one color more than the rainbow. Rainbows have red, orange, yellow, green, blue, indigo, and violet.
The 8 striped also symbolized different things. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rainbow_flag_(LGBTQ)
I agree with what you’re saying. As they keep adding more things to the flag, it becomes cluttered and harder to see.
Who owns the intellectual property of these flags?
I’m pretty picky about flags but I like the progress pride flag well enough. not over the moon about it, but I fly it outside my house during June. If you can make a better one, it’s always okay to attempt to do so.
meh I honestly kind of like it - I especially think the intersex symbol ties it together really well
Oh god please no
Haha I came here to link this. One of my favorite videos.
OHIO!!
I’m just mad they didn’t add Italians and Jews to the progressive flag, cmon!
Its purpose isn’t to be aesthetically pleasing. Trans people and POC are constantly discriminated against by other queers, and intersex people rarely are even acknowledged to exist at all, let alone treated as anything else than disgusting or sex object.
This here boggles my mind. Why would you discriminate against others when you yourself know what discrimination feels like?
Strange is the world of bigotry.
Some think they can curry favour by thowing the bigots a bone. The ‘LGB drop the T’ group can fly under a radar for a bit by piling in on the most hated upon group but don’t seem to realise that they will be squarely back in their sights once the job is done…
This is my take too. I don’t care how appealing the flag looks, but it needs to call out discrimination.
i just learned last week about the original lesbian flag:
and i gotta say it’s amazing
Fair warning with that one, its really cool looking but mostly popular with trans lesbians and terfs.
as a trans lesbian… ok that tracks. but a warning??
I’ve seen TERFs use it less, as they’ve started to win the “trans debate” less of a need to disguise their shit as “protecting lesbians”
Flags are stupid in the first place though. All flags, it’s nothing to do with these specifically.
Agreed.
Though I do think that if progressive-minded people were more apt to fly the American flag at protests, it would be harder to criticize them.
