I have been looking for manufacturing, assembly, production positions all over the Midwest. It’s absolutely shocking how many of them want you to work rotating shifts.
Look at the image I submitted. That company wants you to work 3rd shift one week, then 2nd shift the next, then 1st shift the next, and then repeat it over and over. How in the hell is that healthy?
And this requirement for rotating shifts is prevalent in so many job ads now. WTF is going on with the world?
Full job ad here:
Most people only choose swing or graveyard with a differential. Rotating allows employers to fill shifts without offering differentials.
I used to work nights and got a differential. I would have been significantly less complacent without one.
From google:
A differential in scheduling is additional compensation for hours worked outside of the standard schedule or at untraditional times, such as nights, weekends, or holidays
This means that since you’ve got shifts at all hours of the clock, there are no “untraditional hours” for you, hence no differential compensation.
Thanks Mr Technicality! Its pretty clear OP was saying they got paid a premium over their coworkers that did the same role as OP but during non night shift hours, and had they not gotten that premium, they wouldnt have been as ok with nightshift hours
Because we havent had a general strike in a while
I used to work at a place with 3 shifts, and they rotated them because everyone wanted 1st shift rather than 2nd and 3rd. I chose to stay on 2nd because it paid a bit more and I don’t like getting up early. It would have been hell to switch every single week!
We switched every 2 weeks. Your sleep never adapted.
We did it monthly, if I recall. I rarely worked another shift, but when I did it was awful. I adapt VERY slowly to sleep schedule changes.
At this point I"m sure the media only associates religion with crazy people because they want people to stop believing in souls altogether.
Nah, pretty sure it’s because so many religious people are just kinda crazy
Yeah, they do weird things like believe in souls
They probably want to maximise the uptime of the machinery
They’re trying to accomplish that without the aid of an industrial engineer who would immediately tell them their plan was shit.
That doesn’t justify the rotation. Just hire specific people for each shift.
It does tho in my opinion
Let’s play this out, what’s more likely to get job applicants:
Job with rotating shifts
Working 3rd shift
They’re trying to “make it fair” so everyone has to share the bad shifts.
Also they’re trying to prevent burnout maybe.
Mostly it’s about saving money cuz they don’t have to pay shift premiums for 2nd and 3rd shift.
They have a few options of what to do while treating workers fairly, even under the framework of capitalism
- raise wages until workers are willing to work the nightshift permanently
- raise prices till demand matches the output you are able to achieve while treating your workers fairly
- increase production throughput by opening additional lines so supply you output matches demand
- bring democracy into the workplace and let the workers decide if they want to work rotating shifts so the company can save money
Fucking over your workers isn’t an acceptable option. As a society, we can’t accept people’s lives being made worse in the name of saving money.
Also they’re trying to prevent burnout maybe.
I dunno about everyone else, but a rotating shift like that would destroy me. A locked in schedule, even overnight, would be infinitely better for preventing burnout for me.
Then make the rotations 6 months, not one week. There is absolutely no need for a rolling schedule in one week increments. I’ve done it. If you want to prevent burnout, that is absolutely not the way to do it.
Having worked 3rd shift in the past myself and knowing multiple people who have worked rotating shifts, there are a lot of people who do want frequent rotations so they can do things on a ‘normal schedule’ every couple of weeks. They either learned to sleep on demand from the military or think they can just switch constantly with no issues, but really do want the frequent rotation.
Obviously the companies are taking advantage of those kind of people by giving them what the workers think they want even though it is horrible in the long term for most people.
I’m gonna guess they have a hard time hiring for the night shifts. I know at my job they struggle hiring people who want to work those.
Your job has a hard time paying enough for people to work there.
Can’t unionize if you don’t have the energy to fight.
Yep, you probably end up working with different groups of people too also making unionization harder.
Actually, that would make it even easier, in theory. You’d meet more of your coworkers and would be able to more easily spread the word and discuss pros/cons, etc.
How would you figure out who the plant is?
By not giving a shit. If they are spying on you, they are scared and you have all of the power.
No my guy, the hero doesn’t always win in the real world. This is where you get placed on PIP or start having performance issues, or get a promotion to a different team where there is a clash with your new manager.
Given any opportunity I will always be for a union but good damn if the cards aren’t stacked against unions.
That’s the difference between us. I’ve always found a way to get by and any work place or so called boss that wasn’t worthy of my time or energy, didn’t get that investment.
Maybe I was just raised different but I am more than willing to tell someone to fuck off if/when its needed, it of course starts more diplomatically than a literal middle finger but I was never afraid to escalate to an actual “fuck off, I’m out of here” when it was needed. It’s one reason why I work for myself, I only have myself and my bills to answer to.
There is a growing movement towards unions and other forms of collective bargaining. If you want to keep being afraid of your own shadow, that’s fine but don’t you dare do others the disservice of pushing them away from taking control of their own destinies.
Can’t unionize if you don’t have the energy to fight.
The Indeed reviews for this specific company and location state that they already have a union. One review states:
“Union is garbage unless the top guys like you.”
So, their union is not doing anything to prevent the insane rotating shift schedule.
If the union bosses are pricks or shills then you don’t have a union, but a glorified HR department. Something we’ve seen lately is that the unions still have to fight to get what they rightfully deserve. Unfortunately the fight to unionize is only the start of it.
My theory is so you cant work a second job thus reducing risk of accidents. Just a theory though.
I imagine having zero consistent sleep schedule will increase the risk of accidents
As someone who’s done shift work the overwhelming majority of their career, fatigue is worse than being drunk.
30hr sleep debt has you feeling horrible, struggling to focus, 40hr sleep debt has you acting drunk, feeling worse and bordering on dozing off.
I had a week long caffeine withdrawal once due to not realizing how hard I was leaning on caffeine to get through each day. Week off came around, stopped all the coffees and spent most of my week of sweating bullets, shaking and in pain. Never again.
The rotating to an earlier shift is even more insane. Maybe I’m wrong but I imagine almost everyone finds it easier to push through and stay up later than try to go to sleep 7 hours early.
Are they just trying to destroy your soul and your health?
Yes,
But likely for a very stupid reason like 50 years ago some consultant had to give a plan to increase efficiency but forgot until the night before.
I work a “9-5,” which is basically remote meetings or email from 7-8:30 while I try to eat something and get my kids dressed, work through lunch so I can take “lunch” at the end of the day to be able to pick my kids up in time, go home and finish emails and hope to wrap up by dinner.
How people are working schedules like this is beyond me. I’m going insane as it is, and my job is “cushy.” My doctor tells me I need to work less and create less stress in my life or I’m going to start bleeding out of my ears, and he looks more tired than I do.
Everyone where I work is scared to quit for fear of working more hours on a worse schedule for less money. Everyone at he top seems to work remote at will and forces us into meetings about how to reduce burnout like they do, which is apparently by working less, having more schedule freedom, and then bragging about it by holding meetings about how to live more like they do, which would get all of us fired within a month.
I wish we abolished the rich already
Fuck if I know the answer to this, but someone I know well and respect works one of these shifts, and I don’t get it.
4 on 3 off and swap the next week, I get.
But it’s like these were designed to fuck up the workers’ health and lives. Oh, wait, they probably were.
Then they’re dependent on the employer-provided health care and less able to leave!
Wow, that’s nuts. At least the manufacturing jobs I see around me are just 4on 4off 12hr shifts, which still sucks IMO, but isn’t abusive to employee’s mental well being.
I am sad that we live in an age where 4 12 hour shifts in a row is now considered the norm.
Its really only the norm for certain industries. I’m just an IT drone, so I still get my 5 8s, but I’ve heard some of the factory floor guys say they like it so /shrug.
I wouldn’t be opposed to doing 4 10s just to have an extra day off, but support gigs don’t generally get that kind of leeway with staffing and coverage issues. But I get to work from home, so I’ll take the extra day a week of work.
Eh, I just think 12 is too much no matter how you slice it. I’m in security and after the 8th hour, my brain is fried.
In CA you get overtime after 8 hours a day, so 4/12s are quite lucrative. I just plan to do literally nothing but work on those days. Work, sleep, work, sleep. Live life on your 3 day weekends.
I find I’m just as frazzled after 8 hours as I am after 12, might as well get a ton of money and an extra day off.
30 years ago I did 12 hour shifts at a factory, and it really wasn’t too bad. It was 4 on 3 off one week, and 3 on 4 off the other week. The OT on week one made up for the lost hours on week two, and having 3 or 4 days off was pretty sweet. But it was a QC job, for a European company in the US, sitting all night inspecting small parts, and was pretty chill.
My brother in law worked at the BMW factory in SC, and they did 4 10 hour shifts, with the days off rotating each week. They only ran 6 days a week, so you’d end up with 5 days off every 4 weeks whenever the days off from two weeks lined up. He liked the 5 days off when they happened, but the rotating days off didn’t line up with my sisters schedule, so that was tough.
This worries me 3 ways:
- shifts longer than 8 hours show significant attention span issues
- you didn’t specify day or night shifts, the latter of which is massively detrimental because of the circadian rhythm and altering your day vs night
- maybe the job didn’t specify, and that’s worse
Worst of all would be a 2-2-4 day/night/off schedule, as that combines a too-long shift, a wake-sleep change, and then a too-long shift in darkness.
This kind of job spec, unless they specify it’s only mildly damaging, could be the most toxic format of all!
P.s. I can’t believe I’m wishing for it to be the minimally-toxic-but-still-fucking-toxic 4x12 daytime slog.
By keeping you rotating they don’t have to pay you extra.
I’ve worked this shift pattern before, and found it very difficult. They call it a ‘continental’ shift pattern in the UK - it’s not a new thing, 'cos the job I’m thinking of was 30 years ago. Switching from sleeping during the night to sleeping during the day is okay if you’re on permanent nights, but trying to change every couple of weeks can be impossible (I remember once failing to get any real sleep during the day, having to spend the next 12 hours at work, and then collapsing on my way home the next day.)
All our cops in my area work rotating shifts. Tell me it’s not to make them meaner.
if you have to work all three shifts every three weeks, you can’t realistically hold-down a second job or attend regular classes, you’re exclusively at the disposal of your masters.
