Curious from people who follow its development closely.
- What protocol are about to be finally implemented?
- Which ones are still a struggle?
- How many serious protocols are there missing?
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With Windows getting sleazier and sleazier, I was really hoping Linux would be in a less janky place than it was when I tried to main it a decade ago.
Lemmy has made it clear that it isn’t.
Lmao what
This is clearly bait
Drivers are still a shit show. The drivers in question have changed, but there’s still extremely common hardware with poor support. I know this is the hardware vendors fault but that doesn’t change my experience as a user – I need my hardware to work.
It’s still extremely fragmented. Yes, this is often a good thing because it let’s you pick the features you want but I’m not interested in comparing and configuring 14 different tiling window managers.
It’s still fragile outside of the terminal. I constantly see posts and comments about peoples OS becoming unbootable or show stopping issues they just can’t fix without hopping to another distro or nuking their install from orbit. The 18th most popular distro seems to be popular simply because it makes it easy to roll back fucked updates or sidegrades.
This stuff might be fine for people who love to tinker but I can’t afford to have my PC shit the bed when I need it for work and I’m not interested in having “chill and play some games” involuntarily replaced with “fix the bootloader”.
And I can’t help but feel like the “anybody who isn’t sucking off Linux must be bait” mentality ensures this is a pit the scene will never escape from.
There’s absolutely no chance you haven’t seen the posts describing these problems. You’re commenting on one right now
More bait.
I have to do far more tinkering with Windows to make it usable than I do with Linux. With Linux I typically install it and then change one or two keyboard shortcuts (not even necessary, just a preference).
I wish Windows was as easy. I feel like in windows you always have to go onto powershell or the registry to fix something. Why can’t it just work?
And don’t get me started on how often you have to nuke your install when you run into issues (which, since this is windows we’re talking about, is often).
The drivers are awful and you have to search them all out individually rather than all just being automatically included.
Installing software is a complicated minefield.
I wonder if Windows will ever be as usable as Linux is. Because right now it’s not improving.
Whatever helps you cope.
You’re the one coping lmao. Look if you want to spend more time diagnosing issues with your PC than using it, then Windows is a fantastic choice and I’m happy for you.
I guess that 4% market share is because it’s just so good. The Linux community couldn’t even pull that off without a multi-billion dollar corporation helping them with software compatibility and stability.
Feel free to keep making fun of Windows though – I haven’t made an operating system part of my personality so it doesn’t upset me in the slightest.
@PoliticalAgitator @TheGrandNagus Well, it’s mostly because Linux is way newer to the computer scene than microsoft’s OS for instance. When #linux started out, computers using msdos were already being shipped for over a decade, and so they were the de facto standard, and it takes time for people to switch to a better product if they are used to another one and have the ecosystem keeps them in (that’s the main reason people keep buying overpriced apple products)
4%? Linux has 6.3%+ on the desktop. Then there’s 6.5% unknown which likely includes a disproportionately high amount Linux systems too, what with Linux users being a lot more likely to obfuscate system information from trackers.
Then on mobile, Linux has 72%.
And Windows is popular because it came first and they have a monopoly. Once you have a monopoly, it’s easy to keep. Is Comcast so popular because it’s good, or is it because it’s the only real choice for a load of people?
Well you clearly have made your OS part of your personality, because here you are vehemently defending it and shitting on other OSes.
I don’t really care. If you somehow enjoy using Windows, despite the myriad of issues, then cool beans. Use it. I’m not really sure why you’re so insecure about it that you need to come here and tell us, though.
I’ve been using it for my daily driver for work and casual gaming with no issues for 4 months now (Garuda Linux)
I use an accessibility tool called Talon Voice. It is x.org only. Will the shift to Wayland kill these tools, or is it a case of the developer needing to rewrite for wayland?
On X11 apps can scan and read what they want. This is not even very good, but developers dont need to implement accessibility really, just make all text scannable.
If this is a screenreader you are talking about.
Apps need to send the reader specific texts that shouls be read, like push notifications. And this needs to be implemented, because on Wayland no app can just scan everything.
So rather than having one single app that deals with screen reading, it’s now down to every individual application to make accessibility a priority.
Huge retrograde step.
We can all agree that authors should all value accessibility, but we also all know that they won’t.
So because they won’t, those who need accessibility, will require x.org… forever?
That’s one of the huge problems with Wayland. The core protocol is super minimalistic so it falls to each and every individual app to (re)implement everything: accessibility, clipboard, keyboard, mouse, compositing etc. etc.
The fact this was done in the name of security is a solution looking for a problem. Inter-window communication was never a stringent security issue on Linux.
It’s like advising people to wear helmets in their everyday life. Sure, in theory it’s a great idea and would greatly benefit those who slip and fall, or a flower pot falls on their heads, or are in a car accident and so on. But in practice it would be a huge inconvenience 99.99% of the time.
The largest part of all Linux apps out there will never get around to (re)implementing all this basic functionality just to deal with a 0.01% chance of security issues. Wherever convenience fights security, convenience wins. Wayland will either come around or become a bubble where 99% of Linux userland doesn’t work.
it falls to each and every individual app to (re)implement everything: accessibility, clipboard, keyboard, mouse, compositing etc. etc.
I haven’t read so much nonsense packed in a single sentence in a while. No, apps don’t implement any of these things themselves. How the fuck would apps simultaneously “implement compositing themselves” and also neither have access to the “framebuffer” (which isn’t even the case on Xorg!) nor information about other windows on the screen?
Please, don’t rant about things you clearly don’t know anything about.
GUI frameworks should implement this, just like any app built on GTK, Qt, Iced or possibly others have native wayland support.
But yes I agree this is not a good situation. There should be something like “accessibility permission” on Android, where apps can basically read anything.
Already daily driving it on my laptop, which uses AMD graphics, and my work laptop, which uses Intel graphics. For Nvidia, there’s missing explicit sync (which should be fixed soon), and Steam completely freaking out (might get fixed by explicit sync). Kwin also seems a bit unstable on Nvidia, but I haven’t tested it for extended periods of time.
I also have a computer with display on an Nvidia card via reverse prime, which suffers performance issues on Wayland. Might be improved on Plasma 6, but that computer runs OpenSUSE Leap, so it won’t get that for some time.
There is also the issue of picture-in-picture, but that can be worked around with Kwin rules.
No problems running on the AMD graphics?
please don’t post that site. I just need a few more things to work well with Wayland like Nvidia Drivers.
Last updated: 31 October 2022<
I don’t follow this stuff at all, so I have no idea what the advantages are of Wayland that I’d actually see and benefit from in my daily use. That being said, I saw everyone saying it’s better, so I tried switching to it. After rebooting, my PC just showed a black screen. I needed to use a TTY to revert back to xorg. So no, as of right now I’m not using Wayland.
Last updated: 31 October 2022
A little out of date. But still the best source I know of 👍
I think that’s incorrect: https://github.com/mpsq/arewewaylandyet/commits/master/
It’s what the site says at the buttom, so that’s when it was last generated.
Yeah that looks correct
What do you think you’re doing by putting that link in every comment? Lemmy doesn’t have a terms of service that assigns a license to your text anyways. So if you just say nothing you own your comment and they can’t use it. If they cared about the licence they would already not be able to use it.
I still use X11 in my work computer because I need keepassxc to auto-type password to non-web programs.
Barrier
I miss being able to just use one mouse and keyboard for everything
Some way of globally capturing hotkeys, for things like starting stream, media hotkeys, etc. Only passing key events to the foreground window is shortsighted, but we need a secure way of doing this.
This is already possible
Mind elaborating a bit more?
deleted by creator
Five years on wayland here, it’s been great as long you don’t have single Nvidia gpu or need https://xkcd.com/1172/ kinds of x11 features
I am using Wayland and the only issue that is a bit annoying is that I can’t use fractional scaling because it breaks FreeRDP clients. Both Remmina and FreeRDP have issues when scaling is active. For now I just increased the font size in KDE its not perfect but good enough until this is hopefully fixed.
A program that I use often uses an embedded MPV window for video playing, and Wayland doesn’t support that, and apparently won’t: https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wayland/wayland-protocols/-/issues/74
So until something changes with that program, MPV, or Wayland, or I decide to rewrite the program myself, I’m stuck with X11.
I’m going to buy an AMD video card this weekend solely so I don’t have to deal with the NVidia bullshit anymore. I’m eager to give hyperland a try.
This has long been the best advice. However, just in case you are not aware, some pretty important NVIDIA changes are expected to drop next months it will take a while to work into every distribution but NVIDIA should finally work as well as AMD.
Yes I know. I have read all about explicit sync. It’s going to take at least a few months to trickle into the various packages and distributions and we’re still trusting NVidia to give us a proper driver with it as well. And we’re assuming there’s nothing else that will cause yet more problems with Wayland/etc.
I’m at my wits end trying to be patient with them (on the order of years). I now understand why Linus flipped them off with a loud “F you”.
How’s the AMD drivers situation on Linux? I always used Nvidia since they have official drivers, but might change for the next card if AMD works better. I don’t use Wayland so never ran into the issues.
If your AMD card is older than your latest linux distro release it’s plug and play, no driver installation required
Wayland works pretty well on most desktop environments toobeware fresh released AMD cards in combination with long term release distros like Debian stable, you most likely will need the driver from the AMD website (not recommended)
Mesa is usually pretty quick to update, it’s just that stable distros won’t update mesa all that quickly. I assume most of them have some way to install a newer mesa from a community repo or something.
I love hyprland, but plugging my laptop into a projector for a presentation and forgetting to mirror displays was a fun time. Hard to explain the default anime girl away without people knowing what you’re talking about that. Since then I’ve learned you can disable that background lmao
Oof that sounds hella unprofessional though
That’s the hyprland community, for good and mostly bad
https://github.com/hyprwm/Hyprland/issues/2930
I have a feeling most of these people are either NEETs or never used a work computer.
I’m on the gay side of the community. Still rough, but a tad better
Judging people’s backgrounds is 100x more unprofessional imo unless they’re like seriously questionable
Idk what specific image was shown. But anything described as “anime girl” could have strong csam vibes assuming this grad school student is older than 11 themselves.
For some reason its normalized in some parts of the Linux community to have sexualized images of children.
The stock wallpaper is not NSFW in any way as I remember
It was just a presentation for peers in grad school. For a fun project unrelated to my thesis. Would never have used my personal for a work related presentation. Just a funny story nonetheless. Getting mad shit from buddies beats being fired or passed for promotion anyday lmao
Sounds like a hell of your own making. Always change the background to something generic. Like a nice tree. Always. Nobody gives a shit about trees.
