Someone commented that sanctions wouldn’t work on China because sanctions were too harsh, and that the US should treat China as a parent does a child, educating them and encouraging them toward US goals so that sanctions were unnecessary.
I pointed out that China and the US do not remotely have a paternal relationship and a culturally American call to China would not elicit a culturally American response from China because of how different the cultures are.
Got banned for “Orientalism”.
Get away from lemmy.ml. That’s the problem.
Just stay out of childish subs like that. They have an agenda and if you don’t follow damned closely, you’re out.
What’s a better world news community?
It only has news about Isreal, is there not one that’s a bit more global and less ideological?
I would start one, but it’s nigh impossible to get people to post
Cool, thanks. Subbed
Nah that one’s just as shit, just with a liberal twist.
I agree from if the goal is tech support, but I also appreciate having discussions about instance-admins in a place they do not ultimately control.
This sums up why I’m keeping this up. Potentially to be locked later.
Its about proper escalation IMO.
A bad moderator should be dealt with by the local administrators. Bad administrators you can escalate to other admins and bring up the possibility of defederation, but that’s really the only move remaining once it gets to admin vs admin level.
So yeah, local-admins handling the situation would be preferred.
Okay thanks. I assumed Lemmy.ml would see this also since they’re federated.
Is that correct?
If they sort outside of local
That is correct, yes.
I mean, Lemmy.ml could see these messages and these topics.
But much like posting in a random Subreddit, there’s no reason to see why Lemmy.ml admins would ever come this way or ever see this topic. So it kind of feels like you’re complaining to the winds here. Maybe they hear you, maybe they don’t.
You probably should find a place where those admins have a higher chance of actually hearing your complaint.
I’m not complaining, and I couldn’t care less if those mods saw this post.
I’m literally asking if anybody else has been banned for *orientalism".
Yes, that happens. If you google
"lemmy" banned for "orientalism"you will find other cases like yours.
/c/worldnews@lemmy.ml appears to be run by some strange people. I got banned for pointing out that Russia broke previous treaties with regard to Ukraine since 2014.
on the other hand, I got banned from /c/worldnews@lemmy.world and I don’t even know why
Sort your comments by controversial and take your pick.
You’re an edgelord with insensitive comments including antisemitism and racism. I’d venture to guess it probably had something to do with that.
I got banned for suggesting that Hamas doesn’t care about Palestinian people, in the same comment where I said that Israel is committing genocide.
Some kind of purity test bullshit.
What sources do you have for Israel committing genocide? I also because I’ve only heard 3rd party accounts from comments on Lemmy, and I was wondering where they all get their primary source that Israeli soldiers is intentionally killing lots of Palestinian civilians.
Israeli soldiers is intentionally killing lots of Palestinian civilians.
Let’s leave the intention aside for a moment. Can we agree that the response from Israel is disproportionate to the attack commited?
First google link tells me 30k deaths https://english.wafa.ps/Pages/Details/142232 or on another link that has more details from where this number comes from https://www.npr.org/2024/02/29/1234159514/gaza-death-toll-30000-palestinians-israel-hamas-war
In that second link it also says that the original attack from Hamas caused 1200 casualties, so the retaliation from Israel has so far been 2,500% larger, bear in mind that most people that die in wars, especially in Gaza (because Hamas hide themselves in civil buildings) are civilians. Can we agree that if you kill 25x the people they killed from you it’s excessive?
Let’s put that in perspective, the holocaust killed 6 million Jews, do you think that an appropriate retaliation would be to kill 150 million Germans? (I.e. twice the country’s population today).
Now with that in mind remember that the response from Israel is intentional, even if individual soldiers don’t think they’re committing genocide the state of Israel is attacking the Gaza strip intentionally (or you mean to tell me they fired missiles and invaded accidentally?), and so far has killed 25x the amount of people the original attack killed, when does it become genocide for you? How many more Palestinian people need to die before you name it a genocide?
I think it is hard to find sources that firmly support the charge of genocide but I also think it is an argument with having. Most, if not all sources are biased in one way or another and can be discounted if you don’t like their particular bias.
That said, some, like Amnisty International, think that not allowing aid into Gaza is a genocidal act which seems like a reasonable argument when children are dying of starvation and aid is being blocked.
Human Rights Watch has another good article describing ways in which Isreal is complying with the IJC orders to recuce civilian casualties.
the court ordered Israel on January 26, 2024, to “take immediate and effective measures to enable the provision of urgently needed basic services and humanitarian aid,” and to report back on its compliance to the specific measures “within one month.”
One month later, however, Israel continues to obstruct the provision of basic services and the entry and distribution within Gaza of fuel and lifesaving aid, acts of collective punishment that amount to war crimes and include the use of starvation of civilians as a weapon of war.
I recognize that these sources are biased but i think you’d be hard pressed to find a source that isn’t biased with respect to this conflict. Lack of coverage of atrocities is, itself, a form of bias.
Personally, I’d say that at least a portion of what is happening in Gaza could be considered to be genocide. It doesn’t appear that Isreal has done much to mitigate civilian deaths and may be actively trying to increase the civilian death toll.
As others have said, the entire lemmy.ml instance skates on thin ice. While the people on it are generally ok the admins have a clear agenda and are not afraid to suppress ideas and discussions that do not adhere to their ideology. I always triple check any news or political posts that come from that instance.
Strangely enough, I haven’t been banned from there yet and it’s not for lack of trying.
Part of me wants to say keep trying, but of course there’s the risk that you’ll lose out on content as other users block .ml or instances defederate. So there are good reasons not to stick around on an instance where one disagrees with the moderation philosophy.
Then again, there are still enough reasonable people over there that most people wouldn’t want to defederate. :)
I agree. It’s better to block specific communities and establish a home on another instance, IMHO. Unless an instance is really bad or just spammy, I usually wont block it.
Even with beehaw, there are some decent communities that are removed from the drama, believe it or not … (beehaw/c/animals as an example: https://lemmy.ca/post/14488834)
The instance is largely run by the very same people who are also running lemmygrad, the instance almost every sane user has already blocked along with hexbear.
Just for context.
The whole instance has become increasingly strange. I don’t interact with it at all anymore.
deleted by creator
Marxist-Leninist safe space for the terminally online is a little strange
It’s a mixed bag. Some communities on lemmy.ml are awesome but all the news related ones tend to be tankie circle-jerks. The mods over there are usually hands-off so I am surprised OP got banned.
The problem is that there actually is an extremely loud minority actively flooding the place with pro-Russian, pro-China and anti-western news articles. They will usually follow up with hostile comments pushing additional misinformation. (.ml/usa is a good example.)
They are so active, I suspect they are a contracted troll farm. I have no proof, but it’s still highly suspicious.
Out of curiosity, I found that I can comment nothing, that’s new
That’s a weird shadow ban, if it even is one. It could just be a bug, which is still not uncommon with Lemmy and it’s various clients.
It has taken in upwards of a day for some of my comments to propagate before, but that was only during the last round of instance upgrades.
Yeah i think i have.
Fuck ccp.
Hexbear and .ML are things. Just take it for what it is but more often than not, if you reside in a Western mindset, those people will see you as the enemy.
Apparently they see me as an enemy regardless.
Hexbear are hardcore and basically only tolerate people who worship Xinnie The Poo and Putin. Ml are more your bog standard tankies who are radicalized to hate all liberals but don’t understand by who
Haha, okay
Lemmy.ml is a lost cause. Just ignore their communities and find the quivalent ones from other instances. I’ve lost count how many times I’ve gotten banned from there for saying factually correct things.
Has anyone else been banned for “Orientalism”?
I recall hearing about that happening on lemmy.ml in the past.
Let me get this straight: They support the Xi regime and the way they criticize those who don’t is to use a term that is racist to Chinese people? I don’t think they even know what they support.
Those sound like orientalist views
/s
If you go into something with a radicalist, extremist or fanatic disposition, even if you started from a rational starting point aiming at a plausible and reasonable goal, you’ll still stray and end up in the wasteland of irrationality.
The only way to not get banned there is to sing the praises of Dear Leader Xi.
Yeah, those mods are something else lol
Haha, yeah it was weird.
Now I want to look through the logs and find out if there are any other bizarrely irrelevant reasons for mod bans from those guys.
Is there a way to just look at the mod log from a specific community?
Click on modlog in the community sidebar.
That almost feels like a misclick. The notion that the US should take a paternal attitude towards China is almost textbook orientalism.
If they were being uncharitable in their reading of your position, the notion that the “mysterious East” would react unexpectedly to our sophisticated western diplomatic gestures due to their rigid culture would also fall under that umbrella.
The mod who banned is probably more offended that the US wasn’t adopting the child role between the two.
There’s also the fact that East Asia does have a cultural quirk that makes diplomatic affairs unique to the region, that being face.
Basically China refuses to let itself be seen as anything but the eternal model nation for others to eventually emulate and revolve around, and the American inclination to not respect that from literally anyone, even itself a lot of the time, one can imagine how diplomatic affairs can average out more tense than usual between the US and China.
It’s the New Money Man vs the Elder President of the Gentlemen’s Society, one sees nowhere to go but up while the other sees the other as a threat to them staying on top, what’s different is that you can read that conflict both ways since while the US is the new kid on the block of great empires of the world, they’re also the reigning hegemon for long enough for generations to have come and gone in the meantime.
Regarding your second paragraph, face is one of the things that leads people into accidentally engaging in orientalism. First, because it’s an arrangement of social forces grouped together and given a name rather than some unique only to them psychological trait. Secondly because giving it too much weight ignores that their diplomats are perfectly capable of setting aside their cultural norms to have discussions just like we’re able to.
These are two of the largest and most powerful countries on earth; their interactions aren’t mediated by the dynamics of office politics.I imagined the concept holding weight for their diplomats like American Exceptionalism does for the US’s. Neither are a monolith, but you can assume that the idea is common.
Not entirely comparable scopes of concept. Both countries diplomats have their own personal standing and career aspirations that factor into how they handle the specifics of negotiations, and both nations have their own agendas, narratives and objectives they pursue.
My point is not that it doesn’t exist or have influence over how diplomats interact, but rather that both parties have diplomats of roughly comparable skill and skill set, with comparable personal desires influenced by the specifics of their culture (standing and pride versus face), and both parties can represent their national interests guided by principles like American exceptionalim and the Chinese notion of being central to the world stage.
Could be they cast a wide net and sweeped up both sides, I was leaning toward that conclusion myself
No, but me being anti-colonialist was cited as a big influence on me being on some peoples’ hate list.
