See title - very frustrating. There is no way to continue to use the TV without agreeing to the terms. I couldn’t use different inputs, or even go to settings from the home screen and disconnect from the internet to disable their services. If I don’t agree to their terms, then I don’t get access to their new products. That sucks, but fine - I don’t use their services except for the TV itself, and honestly, I’d rather by a dumb TV with a streaming box anyway, but I can’t find those anymore.
Anyway, the new terms are about waiving your right to a class action lawsuit. It’s weird to me because I’d never considered filing a class action lawsuit against Roku until this. They shouldn’t be able to hold my physical device hostage until I agree to new terms that I didn’t agree at the time of purchase or initial setup.
I wish Roku TVs weren’t cheap walmart brand sh*t. Someone with some actual money might sue them and sort this out…
That sucks, but fine - I don’t use their services except for the TV itself, and honestly, I’d rather by a dumb TV with a streaming box anyway, but I can’t find those anymore.
Search for monitors, not televisions. For example, you can get an 48in and 55in OLEDs dumb monitors with multiple HDMI inputs.
And where do you plug in the aerial to watch TV? Or doesn’t it work like that where you’re from?
Hasn’t worked like that in the US for a couple decades. I remember early 2000’s there was a push to go digital and a lot of people with older TV’s that didn’t have coax or similar were given dongles by the government so they could make tv signals all digital. No more aerials on TVs.
My new (2023) Philips Roku TV has an antenna input and receives OTA digital channels just fine.
You’ll need to buy TV tuner with HDMI to do that.
But honestly, I probably wouldn’t go the monitor route unless you were all in on streaming.
Which most people are or should be tbh. Also, if anyone is searching for a dumb TV it’s more or less guaranteed they’re tech savvy enough to be running some sort of stream box/pc anyways for the TV.
TV tuners are fairly cheap.
Never heard of them please elaborate a bit, I’m always open to learning new and better stuff.
HDHomeRun is one of the common brands. They have a couple that can even demodulate ATSC 3.0.
Antenna TV is still kind of nice in that there is live coverage, it’s free, and it works when the internet is out. I get the appeal.
I dumped my satellite TV subscription service last year when I realised all we ever watched on it were on-demand services. I hooked one of the dish feeds into the TVs own socket since it was there, but beyond testing it worked it’s had no more than an hours use in the last six months.
We just watch stuff on the TVs streaming apps instead of the satellite decoders streaming apps (saving about 100kWh a year).
One of the few times we watched live TV, it was just on I. The background and we realised the show that was on seemed interesting, we’d missed the first 10 minutes but there was an option to press a button and open the on-demand app and restart immediately from the beginning.
Be careful with this as monitors are usually a different aspect ratio to a TV so a you may get a distorted/cropped picture or black bars (depending what you connect to it) which will be noticeable at larger sizes.
monitors are usually a different aspect ratio to a TV
What? Aren’t like 90% of monitors and 99% of TVs 16:9? There are a few monitors that are 16:10, some extremely rare 5:4 and 4:3 and then there are the ultrawide monitors which are obviously a different aspect ratio but saying that monitors are “usually” a different aspect ratio is factually incorrect. If you’re deciding between a 4K TV and 4K monitor, then there’s no danger of accidentally buying something of different format.
Nah there are more
5:4, 8:5, 21:9, 64:27. And more.
And these aren’t exact. There’s fault tolerance, so to speak. You can have slightly different sizes rectangles between several different 16:9 monitors.
Nah there are more
5:4, 8:5, 21:9, 64:27. And more
I already mentioned 5:4 and 8:5 equals 16:10.
21:9 and 64:27 are just ultrawide formats which I also mentioned and you can’t really mistake those for 16:9, can you? Same goes for 5:4 and 4:3 which are rather square-ish (4:3 was typical for old CRT monitors and TVs).And these aren’t exact. There’s fault tolerance, so to speak.
I don’t think “fault tolerance” means what you think it means.
You can have slightly different sizes rectangles between several different 16:9 monitors.
Are you telling me that there are monitors that don’t have square pixels? Or that the number of (square) pixels doesn’t give an exact 16:9 ratio?
Anyway, yes, there are more aspect ratios out there but the important thing is how common they are. I just looked at the biggest local e-shop and if I try to filter parameters by resolution, I get this:
The number in the parenthesis next to the resolution is the number of products. (Note that this is only showing 1609 out of the total 1629 items - if I scroll down, there are 20 other options which all have 1 product each so I took the liberty to ignore those as those are ultra rare items (and some of them aren’t even regular monitors but just some specialized displays. Even here, for example the 2200×1024px is an e-ink touch screen)).
I simplified each ratio to the simplest form, so those are exact ratios (but for some added a ratio with X:9 or X:10 in the denominator in parenthesis for easier comparison to those more standard formats). Turns out that 1379 out of 1609 monitors are exactly 16:9, so that’s 85.7%. The biggest variety are among the ultrawides which I colored in purple but again, those are pretty much unmistakable. Just like the 5:4 and 4:3 in blue.
So realistically you have to watch out for the red ratios where 1379 out of 1426 are 16:9, that’s 96.7%.
So I really wonder how you came to the conclusion that “monitors are usually a different aspect ratio to a TV”.
Now of course one e-shop isn’t a completely representative sample but I hope we can agree that the numbers will be in the right ballpark. Feel free to make your own statistics from a different source.fault tolerance
1280 x 800 is 16:10
1280 x 768 is also 16:10.
1280 x 720 is 16:9
No, it is not exact. Yes there is a “fault tolerance” built into how we describe aspect ratios, unless you want to get way more specific.
Dude, what the hell you’re onto?
1280 x 800 is 16:10
That’s exact.
1280 x 720 is 16:9
Also exact.
1280 x 768 is also 16:10.
In the link you provided, it literally says it’s 5:3. It even has its own line in the infographics. And while the article is titled “List of common resolutions”, it looks more like an exhaustive list of almost any resolution that has been ever used in any kind of consumer device. It’s definitely not limited just to standard computer monitors so that table isn’t really that relevant to the topic of the discussion.
Also show me a monitor with the 1280 x 768 resolution that’s currently available on sale.
You’re picking up some extremely rare cases to make an argument that your initial statement about “usually different aspect ratio” was correct but that’s not how it works. That’s just moving goalposts.
No I’m looking at the most common cases but you do you.
This is a really good advice. I will be looking for a new TV soon and it seems like there are no more dumb TVs.
Commercial display TVs are dumb. They are TVs meant for store displays and lack “smart” functionality.
Ive got a TOS for them:
SECTION I
a. This contract expressly and to the fullest extent of the law binds that I did not read, nor am I bound to the terms and agreement laid out in any agreement that I agreed to. Any financial gains are automatically won by me in arbitration and any losses acrued are paid for by the Company to me with interest. Here is a vague copy/paste of about 9 more incoherent paragraphs full of “legal jargon” that never really state any clear purpose or definition of services rendered.
…
SECTION IX.
a. BY READING OR NOT READING THIS NOTICE COMPANY ASSUMES AND ACCEPTS ANY AND ALL FINANCIAL LIABILITY THEREIN. COMPANY AGREES TO PAY ME $75,000 FOR EDITING THIS CONTRACT (STANDARD GOING RATE PER DAY) PER DAY EFFECTIVE FOR 3 DAYS MAXIMUM TOTALING $225,000 PLUS TAXES AND INTEREST PAID.
b. COMPANY HAS UP TO 5 DAYS TO RESPOND TO AND DISPUTE THIS CONTRACT(They can’t. It is legally and eternally binding). THANKS FOR THE MONEY NERDS
Hisense did this to me and my TV, but in fact actually broke the TV’s wifi when it forced an update that I didn’t want and couldn’t decline. I argued with them and escalated it for 4 months and nothing came of it. I reported them to my state’s attorney general and the BBB. But this is definitely a class action lawsuit that will happen sooner or later.
I have a Hisense and had a similar experience. I was watching something fullscreen on an HDMI input, and then it suddenly switched inputs and showed a fullscreen firmware update prompt. I had no choice available other than to agree to update the firmware, no cancel button, couldn’t change inputs, nothing, the only choice was to update the firmware. So I unplugged the TV.
About 10 seconds after I powered it back on, the exact same update prompt happened, still with no choice to decline it. I pulled power and booted it back up one more time just to be sure, met with the update prompt again.
This made me very angry.
The next time I powered it on, I had a packet capture running to see where it was phoning home. I created a firewall rule blocking all the hostnames it tried to connect to at startup, pulled the plug, and then booted it back up. No more update prompt, and it hasn’t happened again. Good thing they don’t download and pre-stage the new firmware, I guess.
Let me know if you want the hostnames and I’ll PM them to you.
At this point I just refuse to ever connect smart TVs to wifi, it’s not worth it
Just in case anyone needs to hear this, bbb isn’t a government department. They are quite literally yelp before yelp and you can straight up pay to get bad reviews taken down from both. It would be better to our them on blast on social media since that sometimes gets the companies attention to try and fix PR.
It would be better to our them on blast on social media since that sometimes gets the companies attention to try and fix PR.
Works almost every time. I had a ticket with a vendor open at work for just about 3 months, and then only replies I’d gotten on the ticket was the “We’ve received your support request which we’ll promptly ignore!” autoresponse upon opening, and then another auto-response a month later saying the ticket was being assigned to another department. I’d replied to the ticket ~20 times asking for updates in that time.
I finally got sick of essentially yelling into an empty room and called out the company, their marketing team, their support team, and their CEO on Twitter, making sure to @ each one of them in the message. I got a reply from their CEO and an actual human responded to the ticket less than an hour later.
It’s shitty and a last resort, but it’s generally very effective.
Believe it or not I’ve had good luck a couple of times in the past when I was getting royally screwed over by what was supposed to be a legit company by looking up the email address to someone very high up in corporate, like the CFO or COO, and CC’ing them a reply in an already long and fucked up support email thread meandering down it’s path to nowhereville. I’m pretty sure I’ve gotten some of the CS reps responsible in deep water, too.
Anyway, the new terms are about waiving your right to a class action lawsuit. It’s weird to me because I’d never considered filing a class action lawsuit against Roku until this. I wish Roku TVs weren’t cheap walmart brand sh*t. Someone with some actual money might sue them and sort this out…
The good thing about class action lawsuits is that you don’t need money. The law firms are just about the only ones that get paid. If you pay attention to class action settlements it’s often something like $3m in attorneys fees, $5,000 to the named plaintiffs, and then a 3 month subscription to the companies own service or a refund of out of pocket expenses, during a specified period, not to exceed $150 per person.
Long story short, firms are more than happy to take on a class action that can be won, but you won’t get much.
Sucks… Here’s your solution going forward, they’re called LFDs or Commercial TVs. You’re welcome. Downside is they may or may not have HDTV tuners, but there are options to get OTA channels that don’t involve them.
The downside is those are meant to be ultrabright for viewing in a highly lit restaurant counter with a really slow refresh rate and they tend to cost thousands of dollars. They are simply not meant for use as a display for movies and games.
Not all. We employ these at my work for various applications such as movie playback and they have various brightness levels too. Look at LG Professional series or Dell LFDs.
Sucks this happened to you. If it is still under warranty, you should return it for a replacement or store credit. Complain that it has ceased to function.
A good set of advice is to never connect your TV to the internet. A cheap streaming box or HTPC does the same function, and doesn’t open you up to issues like this. Your TV is also almost certainly selling your viewing data if you have it connected to the internet.
Almost certainly - but that is what I agreed to when I bought the TV.
Like I said in the post, I’d much prefer dumb TVs, but they I can’t really find them anymore. Best I can do is buy a smart TV that’d won’t let you do anything (including selecting inputs) until you connect it to the internet, agree to their horrible anti-consumer licensing agreement. Only then to open up a different smart device product that will still steal my data and force me to give up my legal right to a class action? The current system is scam.
Do you have any recommendations for dumb TVs?
Look for computer monitors instead of a TV.
I’ve had LGs for years (just got a new C3 OLED) and they don’t require internet access to function. My current OLED isn’t connected and works perfectly fine. I use a standalone Roku for streaming.
I think that I’m about to sold on LG TVs. Do you need to agree to any terms of service for initial setup? Additionally, do you have to navigate menus on startup to get to the streaming device? If so, that is ok, but very annoying if I can’t set it up to start on a particular input on power up.
I did have to agree to the terms during setup. You do NOT have to navigate menus on startup. It remembers the last input and defaults there. You can then easily change the input via the remote if needed.
This is really good/useful info - thank you!
As someone in pro AV, here’s my recommendation for a dumb TV: A smart TV that you never connect to your wifi.
All that bloatware shit they install is what makes it cheap. At my job I can buy commercial displays (no crapware) at cost and it’s still cheaper to buy a consumer one.
Unless IP control is absolutely mandatory for you, it’s cheaper and easier to go consumer for displays
I’m pretty sure that you cannot use a roku-enabled device for any purpose until you agree to their terms of service, which just puts me back into the same boat.
Do you have any recommendations for actual dumb TVs?
Any TV that you just don’t connect to the internet at all, ever.
Hmm, yes, I agree! Totally agree on this. No argument. I’m curious though - what TV would that be? What TV can someone buy today that doesn’t require an initial setup process that requires an agreement to certain terms and conditions prior to use?
Not trying to be hostile towards you in particular. I’m feeling frustrated with this answer because I am seeing it a lot (both online and in online searches right now), but I’m having some difficulty finding it actually useful advice. Many devices are setup from the factory to not allow use until agreeing to certain terms and conditions that must be agreed to before using the TV. I need to know which TVs - if any - do not require this. It is surprisingly difficult! I feel frustrated with this answer because it feels reductive & dismissive of the actual problem.
Again, nothing against you in particular. I’m just frustrated with this - seemingly reasonable but not actually applicable based on what I have been able to research online so far - answer.
Show me one piece of technology in your life that didn’t come with T&C that put you at a disadvantage against the manufacturer, I’ll show you ten fairies, a unicorn, and the herald of darkness.
My grandmother has a Philips dumb TV that doesn’t have any network connectivity and it still showed a click-through T&C. If you can’t get something like that in your region, ship from the EU, they’re still sold here.
My computer was built from pieces of other computers, to which I installed linux and never had to agree to anything. Now show me those ten fairies, the unicorn, and the herald of darkness please…
I just bought a Roku smart TV and the first time I powered it on, it asked if I wanted to enable smart features by connecting to the Internet. I said no and it functions like a dumb TV now. There are a couple brands that still make dumb TVs but they are all fairly small and not great quality. Much better off researching which smart TVs can be easily disabled.
This is the point that I’ve been stuck on. There doesn’t seem to be clear, easily available, documentation on which models those are. However, I have been able to find many ramble-ly “old man yells at cloud” forum & social media posts (You know, like this one!) when a model doesn’t allow it.
I did a factory reset on my Roku several months ago and it works more or less like it would normally. Can’t set themes, which is the only big lack, but most of the important settings are still available. I know I can change the inputs and settings and stuff on it, though, because the hdmi1 is classed to PlayStation and 4 to computer.
I just did a factory reset and never connected to the internet. You can’t disconnect it from the internet without a reset, tho, or you’ll get “not connected” messages frequently, which I assume is what you are talking about.
Sceptre makes modern, affordable dumb TVs.
We found an answer! Thank you!
I’ve been searching online between comment responses looking for actually useful recommendations. It looks like Sceptre or LG are going to be good starting points. Between the two website, I’m leaning pretty heavily towards the Sceptre. I’m excited to here more from the person posting about the professional/commercial AV displays.
I have a sceptre, I love it. I got it on a black friday sale before covid, and it still works well. Some people have said theirs went crappy within a year or two, so check models and reviews that seem legitimate to figure out which ones are crappy.
Thanks for the heads up - will do!
EDIT: Out of an abundance of curiosity, what model do you have?
deleted by creator
Those often don’t have a very good picture quality though.
A non Roku Smart TV that you just don’t connect to the internet at all, ever
Buy a really large computer monitor
That would be a good idea if there wasn’t a 100x difference in price for something actually tv size big.
Not for a dumb tv but I own a newer Vizio. I actually use it as a huge desktop monitor through HDMI. The actual tv itself has never been connected to the internet. You could connect a streaming stick (roku, amazon, google) if you wanted to. I stream everything from the net. Vizio has a horrible “free” streaming tv service that tracks you. But you can still use the actual tv in other ways if you don’t connect it to the net. It will act as a dumb tv.
Until we have a federal privacy law that allows us to opt out of being tracked on every device, you have to “work around” the problems.Until we have a federal privacy law that allows us to opt out of being tracked on every device, you have to “work around” the problems.
Tracking needs to be opt-in, not opt-out. Privacy needs to be the default on all products.
None of this is cutting edge technology, so my setup isn’t for tech enthusiasts. I have an old 1080p TV and an HTPC. The computer has fairly silent parts to begin with, and I’ve further tweaked it to be even more silent. It’s also running Fedora, and Gnome seems to be surprisingly good for this purpose. A Logitech keyboard/touchpad serves as my remote.
This way, I can watch YouTube on my TV with ublock origin and spinsor block enabled.
Hi, I just bought a Roku streaming box. What should I do next?
While it’s good advice to never intentionally connect TV to internet, some devices bypass you if they can. I think it was samsung that would connect to any other samsung product and through them to the internet, even if the other product was in your neighbor’s living room.
This is disturbing. I wanted to know more so I googled it but I found nothing. Where did you hear this?
Not sure of Samsung’s offering but it sounds very similar to Amazon Alexa’s sidewalk “feature”
Sounds like Windows “Delivery Optimization” for Microsoft updates as well.
Somewhere on Lemmy in the last two months. They had a link to a review about it. Sorry, there was a reason I hedged with “I think.”
That’s creepy
Are you a wealthy lawyer at a huge firm? If so do not sign it! If not, your participation in a class action suit would net you about $7.50
If you are simply a man of principle, I feel you but this world is no longer meant for you. Either become a recluse monk or click the button like the sheep we have become and just let a little bit of extra bitterment enter your soul.
Send this to leuis rossmann.
I like everyone saying “but this is surely illegal!” as if these corporations actually care. At least in the US, it really doesn’t matter what the law says at this point.
Corporations will do what they want and the law will be modified to reflect that, this is the current status quo and it is going to take significant political action (specifically making rich people afraid again to piss the rest of us off too much) to make it change.
It’s just an exhausting uphill battle that never ends. I don’t have the time or resources to combat monied corporations.
At this point, it’s like they’re trying to get everyone to pirate everything.
Report Roku to the FBI for violating the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act by hacking into and sabotaging your property.
That’s a sincere suggestion, by the way. This shit should literally be a crime.
Yeah, that would definitely not go anywhere. Roku isn’t hacking into their device. OP probably bought a Roku Smart TV for like $75 (the cost is subsidized by Roku, hence why it’s so cheap) and is now complaining about it. It’s like buying an Amazon FireTV and then complaining about Amazon having control over the TV.
Non American here, and also not a lawyer, but I’m curious what the correlation is between consumer rights (or lack of) and the relative cost of the product. This is somewhat different to buying a cheaply manufactured product and it unsurprisingly falling to bits - though in many jurisdictions there are even basic rights for that situation, the price is irrelevent. Someone elsewhere in chat has suggested suing in small claims for the cost of the product, due to Roku intentionally bricking their own product unless the rightful owner (is the purchaser even the owner?) agrees to certain terms, even though OP purchased it in good faith. If a straight up refund is not available during a straight forward opt OUT option, we have a very unfair situation for the rightful owner of this product. Needless to say opting out should be as straight forward as opting in. Your suggestions is that if a product is of or below a certain price you must bend over and gratefully accept the corporation you paid money to, then inserting anything they like up your rear end. In my opinion your thesis is not price based as this is a common practice unfortunately in the consumer (and enterprise for that matter) tech industry where we have had shiny brand even expensive products initially sensitively torpedoed up our various orifices, only for brand HQ weeks later to press a button which flicks open hidden blades in the torpedo. No one wants or deserves this. The question is what recourse is there in OP’s jurisdiction.
I may be misunderstanding you if actually you mean that any tech corp can do such a thing at any time that you have paid for. In which case we agree. But it’s far from ideal and shouldn’t be accepted.
I’m not saying it’s right for them to do this, it’s a shitty practice and I’d definitely be pissed off. What I’m saying is there’s probably a clause in the EULA/TOS that pretty much says Roku has control over the function of the TV and either you accept those terms or you don’t use the TV. The price comparison was just pointing out the difference in experience between getting a $50-75 Amazon Fire tablet vs a $700 Samsung Galaxy tablet. The former is going to have ads all over it and Amazon controls it essentially, they tell you this, meanwhile the Galaxy tablet most likely has no advertising or additional strong-arming since you’re paying a lot more for it. The company is always out to get their income one way or another is simply the point I was making.
There is practically zero consumer protection in the US (assuming OP is from the US).
Thanks for clarifying. Yeah none of this is ideal for consumers.
No problem, this is essentially the Human Cent-iPad South Park episode playing out in real life… Obviously without the shit eating and mouth to ass sewing 😂
Don’t do this. This just creates more work for the FBI and you know that report is going straight into the rubbish bin. That is just wasting public resources.
Piss off. You’re not even an American. Don’t tell us what to do with our FBI.
I am American.
Imposter! No Murcan would use “rubbish bin”.
“Offence” as opposed to offense, and “behaviour” instead of behavior are also non-standard for American English.
So I looked at his post history, and sure enough, there are multiple instances of “cheque” instead of check, “centralised” instead of centralized, and other obvious uses of British or Asian English.
Maybe NateNate60 is American by citizenship, but doesn’t appear to be a native American English speaker.
It’s almost as if being American and speaking languages are separate things!
Always has been two different things. America is a melting pot and the number of people here with English as a second language here is very high, perhaps higher than anywhere else, I don’t know. It’s great for me because I’ve picked up a lot of language that way. Also, I used to be able to write and spell words better than I do now, but non-American English still sticks out to me for whatever reason.
But with the amount of trolling going on, especially by people pretending to be American leading up to the next election, it’s always a good idea to take a second look at claims of citizenship when someone’s credibility in a thread rests on their statement, “I am an American!”
Way to sleuth!
you know that report is going straight into the rubbish bin.
In that case, you should additionally complain to your Congressperson that the FBI isn’t doing their goddamn job.
No, what’s more productive is writing that this should be a crime. It’s currently not.
If you think otherwise, let’s pretend you’re a prosecutor. Which offence do you accuse them of committing (use a legal citation to refer to a specific section), list out each of the elements of that offence and explain why you believe each of them is satisfied.
No, what’s more productive is writing that this should be a crime. It’s currently not.
It’s at the very least coercion by ways of property damage, at least in sane legal systems.
Also it’s generally not the job of citizens to figure out which paragraph exactly to throw at an accused, that’s what police and prosecutors are for.
The parent commenter asserts that it is a crime. What I essentially said is “prove it”. I assert there is no law that makes this behaviour a criminal offence. Prove me wrong. Don’t say “Well, this is what the law should be”, tell me what the law is.
If you want to talk about what the law ought to be, write to your legislators. It’s not the FBI’s job to write the rules. They only enforce what’s already there.
I don’t think the behaviour is right, and it may be illegal in other ways, but it isn’t a crime, and if it isn’t a crime, reporting it to a law enforcement agency is just wasting your time.
and it may be illegal in other ways,
And it is the responsibility of law enforcement to figure that out. If I go to the police and say “that guy stole from me” and the actual criminal case ends up not being for theft but embezzlement, did I waste the agency’s time?
You don’t need to have a law degree to be entitled to file a complaint with the system.
By “illegal in other ways” I mean “creates a civil cause of action”. This is not something the police can help with. You don’t need a law degree to complain but I think you’re just being purposefully obtuse.
It’s not a crime per se, but it does open them up to civil litigation. Because it’s a contract of adhesion, where the consumer gains nothing from the additional terms, cannot negotiate the terms prior to acceptance, and is forced into accepting the terms on a take-it-or-leave-it basis.
In order for a contract to be enforceable, both sides need to be able to negotiate the terms, and both sides need to receive something meaningful from said contract.
I think you’re likely right, but I think this is also why reporting it to the FBI is a waste of time. The FBI only deals with criminal matters.
I had the same on my 3 yr old Vizio TV earlier this week. TV was useless until I agreed. I don’t know whether it operates without an internet connection, because it has a couple Apps I use that are not supported on my Fire Stick
I have a Vizio as well. It’s been disconnected from the internet for at least 2 years now and functions fine. I guess I miss out on updates, and if I press the Vizio “home” button it freezes up as it’s trying to connect for 20-30 secs before I can do anything, but works fine with an external Android or Apple box. You obviously won’t be able to use any of their apps if you disconnect from the internet, but it’s 100% worth it.
Are you able to use the built-in airPlay/Chromecast, if it’s on your local network but not the internet and assuming you have a model with that?
Not sure about chromecast, but for AirPlay you don’t need internet connection. It’s probably the same for both, but I use an AppleTV and used a Xiaomi Mibox 3 before that, and would just cast to those if I need.
Why would a TV need an update? What’s changed that would require updating to continue to display the signal it’s getting?
I have a Vizio that isn’t connected to the Internet and it’s essentially a computer monitor for my htpc that I control.
If it ever forces me to update I’m getting rid of it.
My real concern is that in 10 years, my htpc loophole will be closed and they’ll datamine me anyway and force me into subscriptions regardless.
Well that’s just it, mostly unnecessary if you’re using it as essentially a monitor (like both of us are doing). Most of the updates would have to do with their smartcast OS or additional features or apps. The updates could also have additional support for devices as new hardware comes out, bug fixes (or additional bugs), speed improvements, etc.
They could definitely implement hardware that automatically connects to wifi without your permission. I guess a solution to that would be to connect to your own internet at home, maybe on a separate subnet that is blocked from accessing the internet.
I wonder if they are planning some serious invasive activities.
Probably. We’re in the middle of a wave of “increased monetization” of streaming. We mostly see more ads, but more tracking helps justify a higher price for ads.
Maybe it’s all Google’s fault 😉. Now that Chrome finally implemented features to block tracking cookies, there’s a potential shift in where advertising dollars are spent. What soulless greedy corporate huckster wouldn’t be salivating at that opportunity?
Yep. I got hit with this this morning when I turned on my TV before heading work.
I thought to myself ‘‘Well… I hadn’t planned on suing you but now I’m not so sure. Lol’’
Yeah. This is complete BS and has me looking at computer monitors for a suitable replacement. I went ahead and agreed to their terms and my TV still works great but when it comes time to replace it, I’ll be damned if I get another Smart TV.
Is there a factory reset button on it? Maybe you might be able to reset the TV and never connect it to the WiFi?
Potentially - but I’d prefer not to do a factory reset. I was/am happy to use the services that I was already using and paying for that were not affiliated with Roku. A factory reset would remove access to those 3rd party services.
Besides that, I’m pretty sure that you cannot use a roku-enabled device for any purpose until you agree to their terms of service, which just puts me back into the same boat.
Do you have any recommendations for dumb TVs?
Earlier you wrote,
Almost certainly - but that is what I agreed to when I bought the TV.
And wrote that they should at least let you select an input without agreeing to new terms.
Now someone attempts to offer you a solution where you only need to agree to those original terms and get a separate streaming device like you asked for and you brush them off?
The situation with roku is unacceptable but please be reasonable with the people trying to help.
How on earth is saying “I would prefer not to do something” being unreasonable with people?
Saying you wanted something then changing the goal when someone offers you a way to get it is uncool.
“I wish my cancer riddled grandmother wasn’t suffering.”
“Well, you could always just kill her! Then she would feel anything!”
???
Even more so, I didn’t even disagree or say that they were wrong. Just that I’d prefer not to do that because, along with my grandmother not suffering, I also want her to be alive. Contrary to popular belief, humans are capable of wanting multiple things at the same time. Have you ever been thirsty while you had to pee?
You can’t always get what you want.
You said you were fine with the original terms of service. You said you wished there was a way to select an input without agreeing to new terms. This person suggested a way to get what you asked for. You said that’s not good enough. :(
Sigh…
My friend, I’m trying to offer you a solution so you can still use your current TV at the very least. Your tv if useless right now, correct? Resetting it and not connecting it to the internet might allow that. And you could then hook up a separate streaming device to it.
I thought that was you goal?
There is no hardware reset switch and in order to perform a software reset you need to get to the menu and to do that, you have to agree to the terms.
One of the reasons so-called “smart” TVs are so much cheaper is because they are data-mining you.
Only if you connect them to the Internet. I’ve got an LG TV and I have never connected it to a network. But yeah, most of the Roku style TV’s are like that from what I can tell. They offer streaming services natively to entice people to connect them. TBD Samsung has been doing this for like decades.
Until they add their own mobile data connection so it transfers their analytics.
No need, just broadcast a local wifi signal and piggy back on your neighbors tv connection!
Time to break out the soldering station.
Where can I buy a non smart TV? I don’t see any available for purchase.
Also weird that you think they are cheaper when that doesn’t work for anything else. Phones certainly don’t get cheaper. It’s just extra profit.
Dumb TVs are called “digital signage” now.
This is it. They’re a bit more expensive, but no BS, and they’re made to run 24/7, so maybe a little more durable, too.
Buy a smart one and never connect it to the internet.
Just never connect it to the internet, or (even better) set up a PiHole and block the TV’s telemetry requests. I say the PiHole is better because then you still get all of the benefits of a smart TV (like native streaming apps) without all of the horribly invasive data mining.
If you want the benefits of a smart TV without connecting it to the internet, then maybe a connected PC would be a better solution. Something like an Nvidia shield connected to the TV, while the TV remains offline. That way you can maintain control over the computer, instead of trying to control what the TV collects and sends.
After reading about Pi-holes for a long time Roku finally pissed me off enough to set one up. The company has been adding advertisements to their menus for years but a few months ago they added a whole new row of ads to their home menu. Of course they can’t be disabled. Enough was enough.
I set up Pi-hole on an existing Pi, monitored Roku traffic for a couple of days and blocked every single ad or “suggestion” they generate. Now the TV displays blanks instead of constant barrage of ads that Roku’s menu has become. Worth the trouble.
Their decision to become an advertising platform instead of the streaming platform I purchased has been good reason to never subscribe to a streaming channel through Roku again. The company won’t get a single dollar of revenue from me if I can help it. Yes, I know 3rd parties do pay Roku subscription fees, but I can’t do anything about those. I also have repeatedly recommended Roku devices for years, but I now tell people to avoid the advertising company. Fuck em.
The company won’t get a single dollar of revenue from me if I can help it.
I’m in the same camp as you after this Roku TV bricking stuff. I was able to work around it by disconnecting it and banning it from my network and then factory resetting the TV and not configuring network…but I’m done with Roku.
I’ll buy an Apple TV rather than a Roku Ultra if I have to…and I hate Apple.
I’m considering connecting up computers to my TVs and just streaming everything from a browser. It will be a little less convenient without a remote (at least initially), but way less annoying.
I used to do this before streaming services and it was not bad at all. At the time there was only one type of mini keyboard plus touchpad available, now there are a lot more options in that category.
It’s a little less convenient, but like you can also do things you can’t with no streaming box such as pirate live streams of channels from across the country for free.
There really is no choice, you basically have to buy a smart TV.
However, even the Roku Smart TVs can be configured as plain old TVs. If you go through the initial setup wizard and just don’t give it a network…you’ll get a regular TV out of it.
I know that there are certain models out there that supposedly reach into your neighbor’s wifi and stuff, and who knows, but that seems a little extreme…at least most TVs nowadays can be rendered non-networked and then you can use them the other way.
Computer monitors seem like one of the few options at this point.
They do not have CEC though so you will need to get up to turn them on, and off, and change input. They also will cost significantly more. Good luck getting above a 40in monitor
While your recommendation satisfied some of the requirements, here is my counter point to arguably the biggest factor to many consumers (figures may vary by region): Regularly priced 2024/3/3 $298 65 in Roku TV from Walmart USA while your recommendation has a 1395 USD MSRP, and actual sale price of $2200 (used at that) on Amazon as linked.
I especially liked that the Check on Amazon button for a $1,400 New 65" monitor links to a Used 27" monitor for $2,200.
I have a 4K Sceptre tv that doesn’t connect to the internet.
I mean, it’s cheap af and might not be for everyone. It works for me.
You can try to Root your TV. https://www.xda-developers.com/rootmyroku-jailbreak-roku-tv-set-top-boxes/
Dang… mine is on 12.5.5 and the newest they support is 9.4.0
Mine as well. :/
