The absolute disregard for Palestinian lives.
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While I disagree with Democrats stance and agree it is a genocide, China would have the same stance as the Democrats as they don’t support Taiwanese independence. They similarly tacitly support russia in the Ukraine invasion.
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Lol, I’m not American. I’m just pointing out the comment from pelosi doesn’t make sense. It adds to the reasons why it might be fake news.
Attributing a comment like that to her works against her in 2 ways. It alienates those americans who would otherwise support Democrats as she appears to be supporting genocide and being racist, out of context.
It also links China to the Democrats for those on the other side, who aren’t watching carefully for nuance.
It’s not a case of countries good or bad, it’s a case of understanding their motives.
How convenient for dem leadership that anyone who disagrees with them is actually a foreign agent.
The Dems and Dem-aligned corporate media have spent the last eight years pushing Russiagate conspiracy theories, and now they’re expanding BlueAnon to include China because the US is itching to ramp up Cold War II.
People seem to be mad about what you’ve said based on the votes, but you’re right. Russiagate in 2016 was a nothingburger and democrats have been riding it for the past 8 years: https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/01/09/russian-trolls-twitter-had-little-influence-2016-voters/
Wait, are you denying Russian and Chinese interference?
So there’s articles now about her calling them both Chinese and Russian agents for protesting. Nice job, grandma.
Might have something to do with this:
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/03/technology/israel-hamas-information-war.html
In case of paywall:
What she said isn’t as absurd as it seems.
Is the article you linked implying that criticism of Israel is just anti-American propaganda? That the people criticizing Israel just don’t know what they’re talking about?
The article you linked is an article from early November 2023. This article from NPR, published on the same day as the NYT article you linked, talks about Israel invading North Gaza with a force too small to occupy the city. The authors wonder how such a small ground force could be used to hold and control the city.
As it turns out, the IDF had no plans of holding it. They planned to erase it.
Is the article you linked implying that criticism of Israel is just anti-American propaganda?
No, but there is a massive pro-Hamas online campaign going on and it’s not difficult to spot the same small handful of talking points being repeated everywhere, which is eerily similar to how for example Russian trolls behaved in the early days of the Russo-Ukrainian war or how Chinese trolls are reacting to any criticism of the Chinese government. Pelosi is very likely reading the NYT and based her remarks on this article or similar reporting.
The NPR article was too quick to judge the size of IDF forces in Gaza. It mentions only three brigades, which is indeed very little, but this was only the initial spearhead. Contrast these three brigades to the fact that the IDF just recently pulled five brigades out of Gaza for training and rest. I wasn’t able to find out how many brigades are currently deployed in Gaza in total, but it’s not a small force.
Literally in the Israeli Times article you linked:
We are both killing the terrorists who participated and killing the terrorists who will want to commit terror in the future,” Halevi told troops and commanders of the 5th Reserve Brigade
This is some Minority Report shit. Israel must have some psychics in their “Precrime” Police devision.
Like, are we all too desensitized to the insane shit being said that this is somehow normal and ok to just be published without comment in a newspaper?
Then she doubles back and said she’s actually calling for a cease fire too…
But what she’s really asking for is a complete surrender of Gaza.
Like when idiots say the invasion of Ukraine needs to end, so Ukraine needs to surrender.
If your call for a cease fire is the victim to surrender to the aggressor, that’s not a cease fire, it’s you being on the bad guys side.
I fuckin wish China was where I came from. I am literally so ashamed of, so vehemently, hatefully disgusted by the nation I was born into, a nation in which white settler ghouls have indicated they’re going to keep their foot on the entirety of my race’s collective neck, that I wish they’d deport me to China. I’d probably find better work, better living conditions, and most importantly, a sense of belonging that I haven’t had since some old settler hag decided she wanted to call cops on me for going for a fuckin walk.
I fuckin wish. In fact, I pray the Anglo settlers try to start a war they couldn’t possibly keep the materiel up for. I’d defect in a New York minute.
Someone needs to pick up a Chinese history book…
Is this the same China that recently lifted over 800 million people out of extreme poverty? Please, enlighten us with your China expertise.
Maybe you can borrow the history book when they’re done with it.
Ah, a kbin poster. I can safely assume hazardous, nigh-fatally toxic chauvinism and insufferable settlerism out of you, can’t I? Dollars to donuts says what you refer to as a “chinese history book” is really just what your masters tell you; and I have no interest in your skewed perspective.
As long as I have to hear about Black folk getting slabbed out by pigs, as long as I have to hear about protestors against the regime getting locked up on federal racketeering charges, as long as I have to hear about how ‘this is the best place for people like me’ when the settlers are trying to put civil rights in front of the same firing squad that erected concentration camps for migrants on the southern border while putting Roe v. Wade and affirmative action to death, anywhere is better than here; especially the people you try to convince me are enemies.
Why are there so many kbin fascists anyway? There doesn’t seem to be anything overtly wrong with the instance itself. Is it a size thing?
Liberal moderation doesn’t purge fascists until they have a counterweight to dispense with to maintain the image of ‘even-handed, adults-in-the-room centrism’. It’s not just reddit’s playbook.
Ah, it’s always liberalism isn’t it. Man I can’t wait until that shit’s in the anals of history where it fucking belongs.
Yikes. I don’t even know where to begin to respond to such a mad, confused tirade.
Just that I hope you get whatever help you need and that you feel better soon.Removed by mod
You alright?
kbin poster
Check it out, identity politics. I’m sure your point is valid and backed by reason /s
You know you don’t have to pledge allegiance to any country, right? That they’re all made up? You can be against the US and China. It’s not hard.
I don’t have a reason to be against China in the first place. If it was good enough for Bobby Seale, if it was good enough for the Panthers, it’s good enough for me. Better the devil I don’t know, than the one that I know will kill me and then tell the world I deserved it if given a half a chance.
I mean, other than being a nation-state they’re also belligerent, racist, and totalitarian. Those are good enough reasons for me.
Your reasons are shit; and without presented evidence, aren’t worth the electrons you inconvenienced to send this western chauvinist message.
As evidence I cite the fact that I can’t ever schedule something with a Chinese company for June 4th because my emails won’t go through because according to the CCP nothing happened on that day in 1989.
Fuck off.
Mate, they are using millions of slave laborers and killing people for their organs in China. America has its problems and plenty of them, but it’s a bastion of freedom and democracy compared to China. Hell, I doubt you are even aware of just how incredibly racist that country is. It makes the deep South look like Vermont.
The US uses slave labor, too. The prison population that they fill with an inordinate amount of minorities, but it turns into the same thing.
Just a crazy old lady ranting on the street.
Is there any indication that this desperate ploy to reframe the narrative of any criticism of Israel’s genocide in Gaza or recognition of innocent Palestinians’ basic humanity and rights as purely foreign propaganda is working at all? It’s absolutely craven
If she stays in much longer, she’ll be the Democrats’ Mitch McTurdle.
So I guess genocide is an American value, and if you oppose genocide then you’re unamerican.
Just another data point indicating that I have never actually been American, and I should have no loyalty to it.
So I guess genocide is an American value, and if you oppose genocide then you’re unamerican.
Settlers built this country off inordinate amounts of genocide; this has always been the score.
That’s what I’ve been telling people who say “I won’t vote for someone who supports genocide:” This is America. All our politicians support genocide. That and “more jobs” are the only things both parties agree on.
If you want to vote for someone who isn’t pro-genocide you’re gonna have to move, or get used to never, ever, ever getting what you want.
Yes, it sucks. But there’s literally nothing we can do about it unless you want to get a degree in physics and build a time machine and sink Columbus’s boat before he sights land.
I just write-in at this point, every single time. As many members of the Wu-Tang Clan as I can remember for however many slots there are. Because I staunchly am a “no genocide” voter-- and there’s nothing that brings me more pleasure come election season anymore than cheesing in the mugs of every settler liberal, elephant-red or ass-blue, who thought they could cudgel a pencil-whip for their mass murderer of choice out of me.
Might transition to writing in Dipset members though.
That and “more jobs” are the only things both parties agree on.
They only agree on that in public, while in private (with a few exceptions) they are fine with the Federal Reserve raising interest rates to induce layoffs to ensure workers are too scared of losing their jobs to demand raises.
I served in the Army and I think this country is a festering shithole of privilege and corruption. I don’t stand for the stupid national anthem, ever.
I stand, but I sing The Internationale instead.
As an indigenous person, duh.
You just have to look at US history to know that we’re pro genocide. Hell, we were doing it just a few years ago to asylum seekers.
Doing it a few years ago? The camps are still open…
So she’s not just an asshole, but bad at geography too. Got it.
Kinda like you’re unable to recognize fake dubs.
This is the same kind of language employed by far right assholes everywhere.
Well… she’s talking about “the administrations” stand that some people are falling for Russia / China propaganda. Granted, she didn’t execute it very well.
You can argue whether you believe it our not, there appears to be ton of articles about it since the Hammas attack on Israel and start of Ukraine war. There are cspan videos of the US government discussing it at length. It’s not a secret that Foreign leaders leverage disinformation in an attempt to cause uncertainty.
Feels a bit disingenuous to compare that to the hate speech we’ve heard ( and being celebrated ) by members of the far right. But hey, you got your zinger in and that’s all that matters.
It wasn’t a “zinger”, I was drawing an equivalence between this lady’s “go back to China” rhetoric and the language of the far right where anyone who doesn’t toe the line is accused of being a foreign agent.
“go back to China where your headquarters is.” Was the quote I pulled from the articles. Yeah not great. Sketchy, yet still not equivalent in my book. This “same” rhetoric feels a bit dangerous to me when you look at the context. But hey, we had a discussion and that’s progress.
“If you don’t like it, go back to $countryTheyAssumeYouCameFrom”, yup. Just a further blurring of the lines between blue and red. By 2032, it’ll just be varying shades of purple, and most of them will be angled toward the fuchsia end.
Do people really expect that there comes something meaningfully out of such a old brain under that kind of pressure? Have you never talked to such old people? They need way more time to think compared to young people. Americans should stop voting such old people into politics, it is just not efficient. But of course, we have the same problem here…
She’s one of the most well known leaders in the united states…
Yea but she is still old and unter heavy pressure, I even would not be surprised if she’d have peed in her pants out of fear. Guess what, US leaders are as well just humans after all.
former leader. She’s grandma with a seat in Congress now, but the press won’t move on, especially if she’s saying Trump level shit.
Thats basically every ‘leader’ of the USA.
Individual encounters may have to do with the declining mental faculties of geriatrics, but the superstructure of the capitalist class (who are the ones pushing the stories about foreign interference and terrorists and red/yellow/brown scare all that pro-empire propaganda) that must change. Voting in yet another capitalist sponsored imperialist drum beater (the only type of candidate that’s allowed to run for election) who’s a bit younger than these should-be seniors home residents won’t change anything at all. Pointing the finger at the advanced age of elected officials is a distraction, simple as that.
Fair enough, well said 😇 only voting young people because their young doesn’t solve all issues, but I guess most young people would at least get what’s going on in the world compared to all that old folks walking like zombies trough that big white building without even knowing how the internet works.
You’re bordering on an ageist take; but by all measurable data, the fascist thanatocracy we’re living under absolutely isn’t it, and is probably prompted by boomer lead poisoning.
Sorry, I have hard time understanding what exactly you want to say to be honest So first, thanatocracy means something like being ruled by a dead person 🤨? And those dead leaders are not old 🤨🤨? And now what has this to do with lead poisoning 🤨🤨🤨? Sorry, I’m a bit confused about what you want to tell me…
While there’s absolutely an argument to be made that we are a literally thanatocratic state based on the almost religious following of the Constitution and Bill of Rights enshrining the Founding Fathers as deific figures whose edicts are to be followed sans modernization, my use of thanatocracy is “everyone who actually runs the show is like five years tops from keeling over and as such, keeps it so that the only views that matter in federal American politics are those that will be dead long before they ever have to feel the knock-on effects of their policy.” Mildly hyperbolic, yeah, but “thanatocracy” rolls off the tongue better than “gerontocracy”, which is what the halls of Congress really count as.
Ah, yea, I think agree with that, if I understood correctly: So the problem you describe is, that many politicians make policies, that they profit from, now and are dead later, when the negative effect of those policies hit. Like earth warming as a good example.
We need to pass a constitutional amendment that sets the maximum age to hold public office (including judges) to 67 years old. You can do whatever you want past 67, but you can’t hold public office.
Read the room, Nancy!
Copying my comment from elsewhere in this thread:
Individual encounters may have to do with the declining mental faculties of geriatrics, but the superstructure of the capitalist class (who are the ones pushing the stories about foreign interference and terrorists and red/yellow/brown scare all that pro-empire propaganda) that must change. Voting in yet another capitalist sponsored imperialist drum beater (the only type of candidate that’s allowed to run for election) who’s a bit younger than these should-be seniors home residents won’t change anything at all. Pointing the finger at the advanced age of elected officials is a distraction, simple as that.
Term limits too
One thing at a time, or itll never happen
If you like having novices in government, sure
I’d rather have a novice who has a chance of supporting something good than an old hand using their experience to enact genocide.
What’s the other option? Let them stay for life?
The issue isn’t lack of experience, it’s that never having to worry about losing the job makes them useless. Watch how fast they get shit done that directly affects them, it was never about lack of ability, the current politicians are just intentionally useless because they all benefit from the status remaining quo.
Just a maximum age is plenty
The fuck it is, if 8 years is enough for the president it’s enough for Congress, Senators, and the SC Justices.
If we can pass down the office of president every 8 years there’s no reason we can’t do the same elsewhere, does it take a decade to learn how to vote or something? Are we lacking in judges?
There are other levels of office, there isn’t going to be a shortage of experience just because we require term limits. Even if there was I’d prefer an inexperienced person than someone who sits on their hands all day and just votes according to their oligarchical masters whims.
https://www.brookings.edu/articles/five-reasons-to-oppose-congressional-term-limits/
This article has a pretty good explanation of why term limits causes more problems than it solves.
This you?
This happened more than five minutes ago so she forgot. Consequences of having an entire government filled with dementia ridden corpses. What can you do?🤷♀️
How do these guys fuck up sitters every day. I’m not a yank but you fucks export all your rhetoric and issues anyway so can you get your shit together please.
This old bag of bones needs to fuck off, get out and vote for Christ’s sake.
I’m voting twice this year
I’m a bit confused by this:
“For [the pro-Palestinian protesters] to call for a cease-fire is Mr. Putin’s message, Mr. Putin’s message. Make no mistake, this is directly connected to what he would like to see.
Let’s just put aside the fact that asking for a ceasefire for most people is a humanitarian request. You don’t need to have picked a side to accept that the ordinary people need some kind of help getting to safety (or relative safety). I’m not commenting on that here though.
It may be that I’m missing something obvious, in which case fine. But, how does a cease-fire in Gaza benefit Putin? I would say that any instability elsewhere in the world (Gaza, Houthi rebels, the Iran Pakistan thing the other week) work entirely in his favour. While the west (and some of the rest of the world) need to move to stabilise problems aside from the war in Ukraine, they have less time, resources to spend checking up on his activities in Ukraine. The media time is split away from what’s happening over there and of course, military budget is redirected away from arms for Ukraine, to operations in these other regions and arms for Israel.
I must be missing something, right?
But, how does a cease-fire in Gaza benefit Putin?
It doesn’t. A ceasefire in Gaza means the US wouldn’t need to send ammunitions to Israel to massacre Palestinians, freeing more supplies to be sent to Ukraine to fight Russia.
The conflict continuing and spreading across the region and getting the US stuck in the Middle East distracting it from Ukraine though, does help Putin. So, this leaves us with a logical conclusion, Pelosi is either a Russian-asset or just relishes in genociding Palestinians.
However, Israel is buying ammunition (at least with an IOU), whereas Ukraine is just receiving charity. From that perspective, it’s easy to see why politicians are more willing to support Israel than Ukraine.
If it turns out in a few years time that Russia leant on Iran to lean on various Middle East actors to stir up trouble at that exact point to distract from Ukraine, you can colour me unsurprised.
Because Zionist usurpers don’t give Palestinians enough reasons to resist? I’m not even Palestinians and I wish I could fight.
I guess liberals cannot be upset that people against the genocide didn’t vote for them. They are all Chinese according to them.
