- cross-posted to:
- technology@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- technology@lemmy.world
Because Boeing were on such a good streak already…
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No worries, it has been towed outside of the environment.
How is this Boeings issue? This is a maintenance problem with the airline. Tires get replaced by maintenance staff. That plan isn’t brand new.
Careful. Boeing already tried the “but it’s not our job” excuse on a few major incidences with an executive now locked behind bars after pushing bribes to cover it up . They’d be best backing off on taking an attitude about where to assign blame. They got a lot of red spots that will never come out.
If I recall correctly, the aircraft manufacturer writes the maintenance guidelines.
This could be a Boeing issue, if it’s due to something that happened at the time the aircraft was built, or due to a foreseeable gap in the maintenance guidelines.
It could be a Delta issue, if they weren’t following the maintenance guidelines, or a maintenance contractor working for them wasn’t following them and they didn’t catch it.
It could also have been (very small but nonzero chance) the result of physical trauma to the plane that wasn’t foreseen, back in the 1990s when it was built, as something that might cause an issue of this magnitude. I haven’t yet seen any information on whether this particular aircraft has a history of hard landings or running over debris on the runway. Freak accidents do happen.
All of those have precedents in aviation history.
Well, if proper maintenance was done and the part still failed due to a design or quality issue that was improperly QC’d (missed, skipped, etc) then yeah it could be Boeings fault.
They’re getting extra scrutiny right now because of all the incidents recently, and all the anecdotal stories of former employees talking about how a bunch of suits are destroying it from the inside to make a quick buck.
And frankly, they fucking deserve it.
And frankly, they fucking deserve it.
Except the suits aren’t going to be the ones hurt by the company going down in flames.
It never is, but it prevents them from continuing to build new planes were profit has priority over security and “accidentally” killing 100s of people
I remember watching this PBS Frontline segment on plane maintenance 10 years or so ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sw0b020OFj4
I imagine we still have those problems and the recent news of counterfeit parts entering the market is scary.
Good thing these recent incidents ended up with no serious injuries or death. Perhaps this timing is good in some really weird way as the Supreme Court starts considering powers of regulatory agencies and concerns around government funding to highlight the importance and need for this government role.
Clickbait. The FAA lists the plane number as N672DL and a quick flight registry check says that plane was made in 1992. This is a maintenance issue with Delta.
The title is “Nose wheel falls off Boeing 757 airliner waiting for takeoff” and that’s exactly what happened. That’s not clickbait, since it’s not deceptive, sensationalized, or otherwise misleading. It’s just news.
The only reason it’s being reported is because of the other Boeing incident. And if they were trying to be accurate, the headline would’ve read “Nose wheel falls off Delta airplane waiting for takeoff”. It’s clickbait.
There were passengers on the flight. I would feel highly uncomfortable after this incident to be on another plane of Delta.
I think you overestimate how much the average traveler who may die when parts fall off cares or is parsing whether it’s Boeing’s mistake or Delta’s. What I’m taking from the headline (we need to get our shit together before a bunch of people die) is different than what you seem to be worried about people taking from the headline.
I’m pretty sure nearly every such incident is reported on in the news.
Now, is it being spread far more due to everything else going on? Sure. But I don’t see why this headline would be weird if nothing else happened with Boeing recently.
You say and yet we both know if the headline was “nose wheel falls off Delta jet waiting to take off” it’d be identically accurate but would mean something else entirely
Isn’t Boeing QA supposed to inspect the plane and sign it off after maintenance?
Why would they?
Because of regulations, because of contracts, because of a myriad reasons I won’t waste my time listing here.
The point is that they have been in business for over a century, that the aerospace industry is heavily regulated, and so I somewhat expect them to have processes in place and responsibilities to make sure the planes are delivered and remain according to their design specification.
And you don’t strike me as someone who knows more than me (a total newbie) on the matter, so maybe we stop wasting each other’s time on a pointless argument about shit that is absolutely beyond us both. Yeah?
Required by law? I dunno, im guessing here.
How many Boeing planes are out there vs number of employees?
No, they make the guides but don’t monitor them, which would be too costly (so much employees needed) and bureaucratic
I thought that there were specific “critical” operations that would require them (Delta, Boeing, or both) to record an entry in Boeing’s Collaborative Manufacturing Execution Systems (CMES) database. But I’m discovering this field, so I don’t know if they make a difference in this context between before and after delivery, and if the normal plane maintenance is covered by the same processes or not, and that’s why I’m asking, and not stating.
However, if one doesn’t know more than me, stating isn’t more correct.
Well, they probably register repairs in databases, but they definitely don’t send people to check every single thing. Airlines also might contract Boeing to do some bigger repairs.
I don’t see how a repair that causes the nose of a plane to “fall off” would not be considered a “bigger repair”…
I’m not saying that Boeing would be involved in the replacement of a tire from the landing gear. But something major enough to make the actual nose of the plane to literally fall off? That sounds important enough to me.
The wheel near the nose fell off, not the nose itself smh
I feel uncomfortable as a taxpayer having inadvertently supported Boeing and they are literally falling apart.
You think Airbus is gonna expand its capacity to build even more planes?
Boeing laid off about 900 QA people back in 2019. Now they are reaping the rewards
Elsewhere: Airbus Christmas party budget doubles.
Does this mean the landing gear wheel closest to the nose fell off?
Oh okay. Yeah I just listened to the audio recording. I guess yes that’s what that means.
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Between door bolts missing, virgin airlines missing wing bolts, this nose wheel, etc
It almost feels like some kind of related systemic error in the very thorough maintenance documentation required for aircrafts, or a large scale sabotage of some sort.
If it’s Boeing, I’m not going.
Your trip is going to get complicated
Working for Boeings PR department must be absolute madness right now… imagine having to somehow excuse all those fuck ups and every week there is a new one
Except this one isn’t even a Boeing issue - this is a plane Delta has operated since 1992. This is entirely Delta’s maintenance’s fault. Boeing will still get blamed for it, of course.
I know, but no one cares who’s responsible at the moment. What people care about is that they read a new article about Boeings planes endangering passengers every 3 days. So while Delta is most likely at fault, Boeing is gonna take the hit to the company image. That’s why I was specifically speaking about the Boeing PR team. Those guys and the crisis managers won’t be able to catch a break for a loooong time.
The company is still worth over 100 billions. They do something right.
Otherwise I agree with you. It’s almost hilarious to see fail after fail (as long as you are not in the plane).
What they do right is having a duopoly with Airbus, and great military contracts. So investors know that even if things are shit rn, they will probably get better again.
Furthermore, while I agree that Boeing probably will not go bankrupt over this, the valuation sometimes is not a great indicator of what’s going on internally. Enron was worth over 60 billion. Half a year later they were at zero. Now I’m not saying Boeing is nearly that bad, but they are in some trouble for sure.
The thing is, every Boeing plane that has any problem is going to make it to the news right now. So it’s very hard to see what is relevant and what is just “one of those things”. So, this will make them look worse than they really are.
Having said that, they have problems. My opinion is that cost-cutting has created all their recent actual problems (MCAS, missing bolts, loose bolts etc) and I’d argue that unless the actual location(s) responsible for these problems is identified, the safest thing to do would be to recall ALL aircraft recently (last 3 years AT LEAST) serviced, repaired or had their configuration changed at a Boeing owned or subcontracted location should be reviewed for substandard work.
My reasoning here is that if we have loose/missing bolts on the 737 Max 8/9 and -900ER. It won’t stop there, it is going to almost certainly be an institutionalised problem of quality control slippage that could affect any aircraft maintenance, repair, or adjustment operation.
But, I’m not an aviation expert, so my opinion is worth very little.
I agree with your comment, even though I have no idea on the technical aspects. What I can weigh in on is crisis management, especially communication.
Boeing needs to take control of the situation and actively start communicating and showing that they are working on fixing this thing. In Situational Crisis Communication Theory you would call it a rebuild approach. They tried denial, they tried downplaying, it’s not working. A rebuild strategy is usually the last resort, as things like admitting your mistakes and fixing them are rarely appreciated by investors. Furthermore it’s usually a huuuuge cost to do a recall on that scale. But Boeing need to show the public that they are actively working on improving the situation, to earn back their trust. So at least a partial recall should be considered.
You’re exactly right in your first paragraph about the news. The media and the public are very sensitive to Boeing quality issues rn. These articles won’t stop unless one of three things happen. Either Boeing gets their shit together and gets some effective crisis management and communication done, the company goes bust, or something else turns up in the news that replaces this. The third option will be the most likely, but it will also haunt them forever. It’s like that exploding galaxy note 7 situation. There were articles about that for every new generation of Galaxy Note, despite Samsung doing pretty well in investigating the issues. And while the following Note phones sold alright, the whole thing was a significant loss of trust and money for Samsung and enabled competitors like Huawai to catch up.
Which, as we know, is not supposed to happen.
Wasn’t it built so that the nose wheel wouldn’t fall off?
That design choice was revolutionary at the time.
I don’t know where to put it but here’s about MCAS anyway, the cost-cutting system meant to keep Boeing in the game, but also took over flight controls sometimes and nose dived planes straight into the ground, causing hundreds (some say thousands!) of fatalities:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maneuvering_Characteristics_Augmentation_System
the front fell off, you say?
It’s not supposed to do that?
Oh it’s very unusual!
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
some of them are built so that the front doesn’t fall off at all.
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Seriously, they just can’t catch a break. Can they?
Yeah, that’s not very typical, I’d like to make that point.
Well, what sort of standards are those planes built to?
This is the best summary I could come up with:
A nose wheel fell off a Delta Air Lines Boeing 757 passenger jet and rolled away as the plane lined up for takeoff over the weekend from Atlanta’s Hartsfield-Jackson international airport in the US, according to the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA).
According to a preliminary FAA notice, none of the 184 passengers or six crew members aboard were hurt in the incident.
The report said the aircraft was lining up and waiting for takeoff when the “nose wheel came off and rolled down the hill”.
The plane had been scheduled to fly to Bogotá, Colombia, and Delta said the passengers were put on a replacement flight, according to the New York Times, which broke the story late on Tuesday.
The newspaper said Boeing declined to comment and directed questions to the airline.
Nobody was seriously injured but the FAA grounded 171 MAX 9 jets and recommended inspections and remedying work.
The original article contains 198 words, the summary contains 150 words. Saved 24%. I’m a bot and I’m open source!
