Its a coming to Jesus moment for party centrists about being so historically wrong they’ve been about everything, this entire time. And this is them trying to make up for it in rapid time. This is them realizing they don’t and didn’t know what the fuck they were doing, ever.
Real answer: We should nominate whoever is most likely to win. The most important and only point is that we need to beat Trump, and we need to stop project 2025. Keeping Biden as the nominee has continuously fucked over our ability to fix this idiotic and stupid unforced error, but here we are. We can fix this.
I think the most electable combination is Kamala + 1. I think that + 1 should be either farther to the left or farther to the right, but regardless you need to get a demographic. The two best options are AOC and Andy Beshear. If you go Andy Beshear, you are trying to pull off NC and GA, and PA. If you go AOC, you are doing so to recover the upper midwest. Andy Beshear is the harder path in an extremely polarized environment; Democrats have been notoriously bad at clawing back votes in southern states. If you go the AOC route, you let her take an oppositional stance on Israel/ Gaza and claw back MI/ MN/ WI.
AOC is a lightning rod for conservatives, moreso due to sexism imho than her politics because she gets way more hate than Bernie even though they’re politically very similar. She’s not a good choice just because of that. I don’t think the general population of the US is ready for two women on a ticket, esp two women of color. Could make an exciting ticket in the way Obama was, but only if Kamala proves to be as engaging of a speaker. Which, honestly I think she’s a good orator but a lot of people will have trouble seeing past the fact she is a woman, and Kamala will unconsciously or consciously have all the usual biases against women in power (bossy, crazy, etc).
I honestly had no idea who Beshear is but just looking him up, I think he’d be an okay pick. Looks like a boring white guy, has solid liberal track record. I feel like a white guy who supports Palestine would be better, Kamala has a lot of pushback from leftists from her time as DA in CA. Idk who that would be.
This hand wringing around what “conservatives” want is not a way to decide who the Democratic nominee should be.
She’s not a good choice just because of that.’
If anything, having them as a lightening rod to be able to put the racism & sexism of the republican party on full display; there is narrative power in that.
You put AOC on the ticket and you let her step left on Gaza/ Israel.
You make the ENTIRE campaign about abortion rights and a woman’s right to choose. Get back to the progressive roots that underpinned the platform that got Harris/ Biden elected in the first place. Activate a base around specifically abortion rights and I think you get this thing in the bag. Women right now are incredibly disenfranchised by the shockingly weak way in-which Biden has responded to the overturning of Roe V Wade. This is a chance to activate the singularly largest voting block there is in the US: Women. And they overwhelmingly support a womans right to choose.
VP’s are notoriously bad at “getting” their states. Beshear is the soft answer and MSNBC is test-ballooning this right now.
If Andy Beshear “gets you” KY, he’s worth it. If he can’t get KY (and really also GA, and NC), he’s a waste of space. But maybe he can do it. I just don’t see any other conservative Democrat who can fit that bill right now.
I think the double woman ticket leaning into the only thing thats worked for Democrats in 20 years, progressive idealism, is how you lock things up.
I’m not talking about catering to Conservatives, I’m talking about the cultural campaign of meme-ification of AOC that conservatives have been waging for years, that could be convincing to moderates and moderate Democrats.
The only successful Democratic presidential candidates in the last twenty years have been Obama and Biden. Obama won because he has a lot of natural charisma, and came along with a story of having our first black president. Biden won as a reaction to the first Trump presidency. Neither were really particularly idealistic Democrats… Obama did not even express public support gay marriage when he came into office, he had pretty centrist positions overall and gave off an idealistic message with campaign art, speeches and slogans, but his actual policy was not especially progressive.
So Obama won as a biracial black man with the conservative stance against gay marriage, and overall very center-liberal politics, but flashy idealistic messaging.
If progressive idealism had been working, we would have had Bernie presidency by now tbh
I just to be clear, you are arguing that Obama didn’t campaign as an idealist?
Not how he governed, but his 2008 campaign. You know, the one where he delivered the famous acceptance speak “The audacity of Hope”. You know, the campaign with these posters:
Your saying this wasn’t a campaign based on idealism?
Not how he governed to be clear, where I agree on your evaluation of Obama’s alignment; but his 2008 campaign.
Obama didn’t win 2008 on centrism or being against gay marriage. He won 2008 in spite of those things.
I think I was pretty clear saying his campaign was based on the idea and image of idealism, but his politics did not reflect that, not his actual politics or his promised politics in 2008. You’re showing me this poster as if I didn’t directly mention the art and sloganing as a major reason for his win.
AOC may have idealistic policy positions, but her public image is so meme-ified I don’t think she could successfully do the Hope thing that Obama did. Obama was much less well known of a politician when he ran.
I think you are muddying the water between campaign/ candidate Obama that misrepresents the fact that he campaigned as a progressive idealist, and it worked to get him into office. His platform was a very progressive platform that he did not govern to; this has been brought up repeatedly as an issue with Obama and was brought up when he was campaigning for a second term.
I think it’s utterly disingenuous to present the Obama 2008 campaign as anything but a campaign focused on progressive idealism even if it was more of a show than how Obama ultimately governed.
Correspondingly, Bidens 2020 platform was maybe the most progressive platform any president has run on since Jimmy Carter, and it was a horse trade that got him Sanders voters and effectively the election.
Feel like I mentioned again and again that I’m talking about his campaign politics. I took a look at his 2008 campaign policies to see if I was misremembering anything and it’s pretty centrist to me, even his health care plan. And like I mentioned, he explicitly did not support gay marriage which at the time would have been an easy progressive signalling, but he either truly opposed gay marriage or he was trying to cater to a broader audience.
Like I said, he had a convincing image of idealism but not the politics to back it up, and you are saying AOC could win because she has progressive politics. She would need the flashy campaign to back it up, and so many people just hate her I don’t think it would work.
Anyway I’m just saying the same things over and over again in different wording and it’s getting tired, respond if you want, idc, but I’m going to stop here.
MN hasn’t voted republican in a presidential election since tricky dick in 1972. There have been a few close calls.
MN Polling: https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/minnesota/ MN polling at a toss up (keep in mind Trump almost always outperforms his polling).
Another fun one, Jersey is now a swing state: https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/new-jersey/
Your comment about “claw back” implies that the dems lost MN. You can’t claw back that which hasn’t happened yet.
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/2020/minnesota/
Minnesota 2020.
Dems up by 10, and polling 15 pts ahead of where they are polling today.
Dems only won MN by five points on election day. Anything close to a tie in polling for Dems is an L.
Yes. It’s a correct statement to say that Dems have to have to claw things back to win MN.
Why the fuck is Michelle Obama even in the list?
Because it is all to separate voters. Divide and conquer. The only and is Biden. Biden or war.
Can’t have america without political dynasties
Seriously. Even here on Lemmy people are suggesting her. I think she’s an awesome person but what makes her even remotely qualified to be president other than being married to a previous president? When I see shit like this it just reminds me of Hollywood and their insistence on rebooting anything and everything familiar to the populace whether they want it or not. If they’d more consistently won it’d be Bush, Clinton, Bush, Obama, Clinton, Biden, Obama spanning the last 40 years in a country with 330 million individuals.
Whatever it is, it’s more than trump has.
To be fair, being married to a previous president is more experience than most people have.
It would also be a hilarious kick in the teeth to Hillary if Michelle got elected.
The obvious answer is “whom ever the corporate lobbyist says should take over.”
I should’ve answered that. But, I picked Harris even though I wanted Whitmer.
Bernie?
I voted for him in the 2020 primary, but if were pushing Biden out because he’s too old then the same certainly applies to Bernie. Even if he’s more coherent and effective now, how will he be in four years?
How about we appreciate the work he’s done but get some actual you get folks who aren’t boomers in charge. His time has unfortunately passed for the highest office but he can be hugely effective in an important cabinet position.
Shutup Feinstein
lol, no you. Feinstein was too old as well. There should be an age restriction on both ends for government jobs.
I don’t think they expected people to live this long when they wrote the constitution, and I know they didn’t consider how tribalistic the country would get. Well, Washington did, but nobody listened to him.
I’ve been saying that for over ten years now, but the time has passed for him. Doesn’t he have a younger protege that we can start pushing?
I think it’s AOC, but conservatives have a disdain for her that I worry would be Hillary part 2.
You just bailed the disdain - it’s that she’s a woman. And a minority, at that. We can never win those people over.
Yes exactly, Bernie has similar politics but doesn’t get the same hatred. There were some Bernie voters who even hopped to Trump. They care more about sexism/racism than actual politics.
I expect to see big things from her in the next 10 years.
If she drops some of her extreme positions, calms down a bit and moves further to the center, she’ll have a real shot at the candidacy by the time she’s 75.
Cleaving to the centre has enabled Trump, because centrists can’t criticise the neoliberal system while Trump and his MAGA cult can and will.
As the facade of neoliberal policy crumbles we can all see it doesn’t work. Being able to criticise it and assert a different future (rather than a mythical past of greatness) is essential.
Aquaman it is.
Harris would be the only pick that would prevent the Supreme Court from installing trump as dictator.
I would unitity, not division
Like Cyclops, Unitity is an interesting mythical character: one boob.
I also like unity.
Danny DeVito
I’m pretty tired of celebrities with no qualifications running the country.
Good choice, but he’s contracted to play the next Wolverine.
If Danny DeVito were president, I would love to America in a heartbeat.
John Cena.
Haven’t seen him campaigning /s
He heh.
After he apologized to the CCP in Mandarin?
Please don’t make this turd president.
Ah yes, Zhong Xina
Come now, that’s just proof of international goodwill and diplomatic accumen. We should all be kind to each other.
Also, being a polyglot is something to always be admired.
No Pete Buttigieg? Probably just as corporate as the other ones, but seems like he’d make a semi-decent pick.
But, like, what if he banned straight marriage and made it illegal to not be gay? ~ half the voting population over age 60 probably
There was a poll a few weeks back that showed Michelle Obama being the most popular pick; take that with a grain of salt because we all know how biased and skewed those poll results are based on a number of factors which we can’t know.
That said, I think she did a lot of great work as First Lady and I’d happily vote for her. I think she’s got the potential to get people fired up and excited about the possibilities, much like Obama did, and everything else aside, that’s what we really need - excitement, enthusiasm, and for people to want to get out there and vote. I think she could provide that moreso than anyone else on the list.
Has she expressed an interest?
afaik she’s expressed a disinterest
It makes me want to vote for her. It’s a tough job, only a crazy person wants it. We should only give it to people who don’t want it lol. Like her or Jon Stewart.
Why doesn’t it ever stop
It’s not just in the politics subs now, it’s everywhere
Please, won’t someone make it stop
You can try to ignore politics all you want but it’ll fuck up your life anyway.
And it’ll fuck up your life if you don’t ignore it either. Talking about politics online does not equate to political activism.
Not everyone lives in the USA you donkey. Your circus is EVERYWHERE and it’s driving me insane. It’s literally all you can talk about.
US politics influence EVERYTHING.
It’s almost like US politics have a slight impact beyond the US.
You know non USA people are not allowed to vote in the USA presidential election, right?
The arrogance is astounding.
Where do you live? I bet the US has a military base either there or within one of your neighbors. Not to mention that the US has caused or perpetuates a lot of wars your country is probably involved in now or in the past, especially if you live anywhere in Europe (who are supporting things like Israel or are in NATO), Australia, Canada, Mexico, anywhere in South America, some African countries, or East Asia. The world reserve currency is also currently the dollar. And they are a major player in all of the major international organizations like the UN security Council (the only part of the UN with teeth), NATO, the IMF, and orgs like that.
I don’t mean to be arrogant. But I assume you realize US politics have implications worldwide. That is why many people in many countries take interest in it. Maybe it would be a good thing if US politics only affected the US, but that doesn’t seem to be the current situation.
I don’t live in the US and I’m as fed up with the whole shitshow as you are. But US politics unfortunately influences the entire world and if Trump gets elected everybody will suffer, no matter where they live.
If you don’t live in the territory of the American Republic, don’t worry, the American Empire aims to change that.
Welcome to Mr. Bones’ Wild Ride, it never ends!
I want to get off Mr. John Adultman’s repeated explanations of why Biden needs to step down
Just keep your head in the sand bruh. Its where you’ve been this whole time.
Hey! It’s the guy with nothing worth saying. That still manages to say it too loud.
If you follow me, I’ve called this entire mess, its causes and its resolutions, 9 months out.
And I’ve pretty much been entirely correct, except that I called that Biden would drop out about 2 weeks earlier than he did.
In fact I have bets going back as far as December/ January that I’ll be able to collect on.
You can have a world view that predicts future states of reality, or can have whatever anti-scientific, reality denying mess Blue-MAGA has wrapped themselves up in.
The choice is yours.
As long as you believed it that makes one person. No on else does. No one has to follow you. We’ve seen you immaturely spamming/trolling, unable to articulate actual solutions. All over the place. You aren’t collecting on anyone. But I comend you on your vivid imagination.
Its all here my dude. Documented for all to see. As is the gaslighting, lying, cult-like behavior that you’ve been engaged in.
I won. History is and will be on my side.
It’s cute you think so. If only believing made it so.
Not everyone lives in the US you idiot.
Gretchen Whitmer.
Garlin Gilchrist is way more pro transit and would be great for Michigan.
Unless they run another primary, Kamala is the best choice IMHO. Already tied to the Biden ticket, so it would feel less like the DNC is hand-picking whoever they want as a candidate. She polls well. Can get creative with the VP.
Please don’t take Josh Shapiro. I don’t have faith in my fellow Pennsylvanians not to elect a Republican.
I don’t know much about him
I’m not American and actually don’t know much about him but aside from the one glaring topic in that wiki, he sounds ok to me? Curious as to what shitty things he’s done if anyone feels like sharing.
Editing to say: the one glaring topic is a pretty fucking important topic in my books, but I don’t imagine any other American politician with a chance having a different opinion on the matter
We probably aren’t lucky enough to get three in a row.
Also, he reminds me of David Rosen from Scandal, and it already feels too much like we’re living in that dystopia.
