Russian President Vladimir Putin promised Friday to 'immediately' order a ceasefire in Ukraine and begin negotiations if Kyiv started withdrawing troops from the four regions annexed by Moscow in 2022 and renounced plans to join NATO.
Ukraine has no hope of winning at this point. It is stupid not to accept the peace offer because they will never get a better deal. But NATO wouldn’t let them accept it even if the Ukrainian regime wanted to. That’s probably why Russia is even making the offer.
Why would NATO have any say in if they accept or not? What would the threat be if they do, they stop providing them with arms and ammunition? Surely, if Russia is indeed so benevolent, Ukraine wouldn’t need them going forward in this hypothetical peace?
Who is calling Russia “benevolent”? In fact I specifically said that Russia is probably only making the offer because they know it won’t be accepted.
Ukraine wouldn’t need them going forward in this hypothetical peace?
Why wouldn’t they? I’m genuinely not sure why anyone would think such a thing. Like do you think that just because they tentatively accept this peace offer they will suddenly be fully propped up economically by Russia after having completely handed over their public assets to NATO countries, largely in exchange for the weapons that have allowed them to put up the resistance that they did against Russia? Do you think that countries exist in their own vacuum and there wouldn’t be massive repercussions (read: severe consequences) for breaking with the western countries they have relied on since 2014 and outright depended on since 2022? And that’s Ukraine as a whole irrespective of who is currently running it…
Most of that becomes secondary when you consider that the current government Ukraine (the ‘regime,’ if you will), the people who make it up, have an interest in maintaining their own positions, as is true for literally anyone holding a position of power. Above reasons aside, that current leadership of Ukraine would not remain the leadership long without NATO regardless of whether or not they accepted this offer if they didn’t have NATO backing. Said government and NATO are inextricably tied, said government only exists because of NATO. So I doubt that government wants to accept the peace offer either and isn’t necessarily in their best interests even if it absolutely is in the best interests of the Ukrainian people, especially the ones being forcibly conscripted to go die on the front in a war they don’t want to even be involved in.
It’s wild that everything you ascribe to NATO is clearly some Russian shit. As if you’re steeped in the Russian view and trying to project it on the west. You think NATO is going to punish Ukraine for effectively losing a war they didn’t even start with a former global superpower? Western countries may have their own problems, but the geopolitics are too coldly pragmatic. Until Ukraine fully sides with Russia, they’d want to do what they can to prevent that.
the Ukrainian people, especially the ones being forcibly conscripted to go die on the front in a war they don’t want to even be involved in.
Another clear example. Ukraine largely wants to remain free. Russia is having to trick people into enlisting, including foreigners, and forcing them to fight. But no, it’s the Ukrainians that should give up because they’re the ones that don’t want to be fighting? For their own freedom?
I wouldn’t worry about defending your thoughts. I found that certain people tend to overreact if someone presents a view that is mildly against theirs, even if it’s well thought out.
Ukraine has no hope of winning at this point. It is stupid not to accept the peace offer because they will never get a better deal. But NATO wouldn’t let them accept it even if the Ukrainian regime wanted to. That’s probably why Russia is even making the offer.
Why would NATO have any say in if they accept or not? What would the threat be if they do, they stop providing them with arms and ammunition? Surely, if Russia is indeed so benevolent, Ukraine wouldn’t need them going forward in this hypothetical peace?
Who is calling Russia “benevolent”? In fact I specifically said that Russia is probably only making the offer because they know it won’t be accepted.
Why wouldn’t they? I’m genuinely not sure why anyone would think such a thing. Like do you think that just because they tentatively accept this peace offer they will suddenly be fully propped up economically by Russia after having completely handed over their public assets to NATO countries, largely in exchange for the weapons that have allowed them to put up the resistance that they did against Russia? Do you think that countries exist in their own vacuum and there wouldn’t be massive repercussions (read: severe consequences) for breaking with the western countries they have relied on since 2014 and outright depended on since 2022? And that’s Ukraine as a whole irrespective of who is currently running it…
Most of that becomes secondary when you consider that the current government Ukraine (the ‘regime,’ if you will), the people who make it up, have an interest in maintaining their own positions, as is true for literally anyone holding a position of power. Above reasons aside, that current leadership of Ukraine would not remain the leadership long without NATO regardless of whether or not they accepted this offer if they didn’t have NATO backing. Said government and NATO are inextricably tied, said government only exists because of NATO. So I doubt that government wants to accept the peace offer either and isn’t necessarily in their best interests even if it absolutely is in the best interests of the Ukrainian people, especially the ones being forcibly conscripted to go die on the front in a war they don’t want to even be involved in.
It’s wild that everything you ascribe to NATO is clearly some Russian shit. As if you’re steeped in the Russian view and trying to project it on the west. You think NATO is going to punish Ukraine for effectively losing a war they didn’t even start with a former global superpower? Western countries may have their own problems, but the geopolitics are too coldly pragmatic. Until Ukraine fully sides with Russia, they’d want to do what they can to prevent that.
Another clear example. Ukraine largely wants to remain free. Russia is having to trick people into enlisting, including foreigners, and forcing them to fight. But no, it’s the Ukrainians that should give up because they’re the ones that don’t want to be fighting? For their own freedom?
I wouldn’t worry about defending your thoughts. I found that certain people tend to overreact if someone presents a view that is mildly against theirs, even if it’s well thought out.
But their view is not well thought out, it’s actually pretty fucking dumb
Found the Russian troll!
Yeah no, fuck you.
Ukraine already won. Russia has been shown to be inept in every military sense and basically they got owned by drones.