Delta has a long-term strategy to boost its profitability by moving away from set fares and toward individualized pricing using AI. The pilot program, which uses AI for 3% of fares, has so far been “amazingly favorable,” the airline said. Privacy advocates fear this will lead to price-gouging, with one consumer advocate comparing the tactic to “hacking our brains.”
I think we should pay for airfare by the pound. Honestly.
Brb, shredding for my next holiday, hoping to book in featherweight class.
finally a decent reason to lose weight. longer life? pfft? have you seen this shit? and there’s no amount of weight I can lose to look better lol.
Aren’t there laws about this in that country? I seem to remember reading about that a while back.
There are SUPPOSED to be laws against it … but will they enforce them?
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This is AMERICA we have the FREEDOM to pick one of 2 -3 companies that will take advantage of us and keep us in poverty 🦅
Of course it’s an Israeli firm that is enabling this greedy behavior. They already price gouge as it is. Can’t we go back to the formula of “our cost + our profit margin adjusted for market”. This bleeding the customer dry bullshit should stick in bullshit avoidable video game micro transactions.
They can’t. Competition for capital is forcing them to extract the everliving profit out of people. Their competitors would not be far behind on this train if it increases profitability.
I acknowledge that, this is the result of unbridled capitalism.
When a person uses social engineering and manipulation to extract money from an individual or company it’s called fraud, when a large enough company does it it’s just business.
If only our government could give us some handy dandy consumer protection laws.
Sooo… If you’re broke, does it give you low prices vs someone who is rich?
Kidding, kidding. We all know they’re going to be fucking the lower and middle income brackets hard as hell with this. As if we weren’t already being milked dry, now they want to milk the very blood out of us.
My question is: What the fuck is the endgame? This shit isn’t sustainable. Used to be that most companies were content with steady profits. The last 40+ years has shown us that simply generating a profit isn’t enough, the profits must be constantly going even higher every quarter. But again, this isn’t realistic or sustainable. So why the fuck has the entire world agreed to condone and enable this pathway that is ultimately doomed?
This is musical chairs, and everyone involved is desperately hoping that they won’t be one of the ones left without a seat when the music stops. Anybody with a plural number of brain cells must know deep down inside that infinite growth is literally impossible, but they all think they’ll be smart enough to cash out before it all collapses.
There’s a problem with that, though: Money has a notoriously poor nutritional value.
The endgame is stuff as much money into one’s own pocket. That’s it.
I was thinking the same thing, considering that I have less money to pay to fly my price should be lower, no? But the article ends on this note:
Early research on personalized pricing isn’t favorable for the consumer. Consumer Watchdog found that the best deals were offered to the wealthiest customers—with the worst deals given to the poorest people, who are least likely to have other options.
So basically the opposite of what it should be. I wouldnt mind individualized pricing if it meant Delta was robinhooding with their pricing model, but instead they are effectively using their pricing model to force out poorer consumers. Which makes sense from their perspective I suppose considering they can upsell more shit to people with more money.
As someone who lives in a top-wealth zipcode (as a working class person) I assume by next year this means I will no longer be able to afford to fly out of town…
Its starting to make sense why the GOP was working to ban regulation on AI use. This shit is blatantly unethical
There is no fucking way that that is sustained simply due to the fact that people would BURN THIS PLACE DOWN if companies start doing shit like that. No one has money as it is. I’m not convinced we’re not going to burn it down as it is.
These elites has truly lost the plot and are going so far down the comic book villain lane, they’re going to start dying like comic book villains. Dunked in acid, frozen solid, crushed by their exploding submarine, eaten by their own rabid experiments… Who knows, but I’m excited to find out.
Look around, dum dum. You see any shit burning to the ground? You think manipulating airline pricing is gonna do it?
This isn’t about fucking flight prices. This is a testing ground. You think it’s going to remain relegated to airlines? If this works out for delta, you’ll see this in grocery stores, in all entertainment, any subscriptions, every single transaction will be reduced to: what is the most you Are physically able to pay currently?
They’re already doing it for apartments and other rentals, and have been for years. Nobody did anything.
Uber started this shit years ago. If you’re desperate, they screw you. You’re well off, they screw you. You’re in the middle of nowhere, they screw you. There’s a holiday/event, they screw you. You’re one of their drivers, they screw you daily.
I can’t recall if they ever got sued over it, but they’re still here.
People will not do anything. They might complain on Lemmy/Reddit/Facebook and then go watch another tiktok
Most people don’t even boycot companies for doing this shit.
people would BURN THIS PLACE DOWN if companies start doing shit like that.
Based on what? People will not do shit.
Based on them literally starving. This is a deranged idea that will infect every aspect of your life if you let it. And when it does, people will starve. There will be violence. That’s my point.
They may abuse us and torture us, but they are psychopathic about it that they are not leaving any bread of circuses. When those end, the top dies. That’s how society works throughout history.
It’s not just Delta. What we really need is tougher regulations to prevent this. Of course there is a snowballs chance in hell this will happen in this administration.
Starving because Delta airlines did a thing? Not sure about that one.
Long term thinking? Nah. None for me thanks.
worst deals given to the poorest people, who are least likely to have other options
(emphasys mine)
Financially, giving the higher price to those who have fewer options is exactly “what it should be” so it makes sense that a pattern finding algorithm trained to find patterns in user data that indicate they are likely to agree to higher prices, produces such a result.
It’s Ethically and Morally that this is the very opposite of “what it should be”.
The endgame is that nobody has money and companies go bankrupt. The end.
The most perfected way to live our lives. That’s why aliens visit us you know… to study our highly advanced economic system. There is no rival in the universe. Perfection. /$
The wealthy have more time to shop around and more money to choose another option so companies think they need to provide extra incentives to get them which means better treatment and prices and etcetera.
The poor? Ehh gouge for all they are worth and hope they die so you don’t have to hear them complain.
Which is insane cause that means the poor are the profit margins allowing for the deals of the wealthy.The higher a percentage of your income is the price of something, the more reason there is to allocate time to find the best price - if something costs you an amount which you earn in 5 minutes, it’s not really worth it to spend time looking for the better price, if it costs an amount which you earn in 2 months, it’s definitelly worth to spend at least several hours looking around.
Granted, as you say, many don’t have the time to do this (though often the Maths for literally taking time of work to do it, do add up), and in my experience most people don’t really make the mental connection between an amount they’re considering spending and how long do they have to work to earn it hence don’t really look around enough when it’s financially logical to do it.
That said, for the reason I gave above, the rich don’t really care about things that “just” cost a couple thousand of dollars, which is why they casually just rent a private jet for a trip - there’s a whole industry for that - or even own one and employ a pilot for it fulltime.
Please let it be stupidly implemented such that I can convince the AI to pay me to fly Delta. (IMHO, how are they even a big airline player? I give it they are a step above Spirit but that’s all they got)
this is basically like “we can’t keep our shareholders happy in their quest for infinite return on investment without you overpaying for our services”
That is a price fixing scam. It is why businesses are required to print prices. Altering pricing is prejudice and if it is not illegal, someone should suffer justice. This is as old as history itself. Delta is admitting to being a criminal organization. Never support the thieves and bandits stealing and looting. Never fly delta.
Problem is that once Delta gets away with it, they’ll all start doing it.
it would be a crime if the consumer protections weren’t just rolled back to 1912 two months ago.
Businesses in North America also refuse to comply with the EU rules surrounding the display of prices including VAT and unfairly compete with companies in the EU. A consumer cannot know if a company has to pay VAT in the EU or not.
How does a AI know whether you’re rich or not?
Welcome to surveillance capitalism buddy
That’s a field in data science / marketing that’s been active forever… assume that companies at large have a rating of their prospects & customers & ex-customers alike which includes a notion of wealth. Either derived from consumption habits or acquired through data brokers or both usually.
But what if I’m searching flights through a search tool like Kayak? I’m not logged in for that, and possibly using a VPN.
Depends of a lot of factors. Best case that’s enough. VPN isn’t generally doing much beside obfuscating network of origin and that’s not accounting for leakages. There’s stuff of the nightmares with pixels and cookies cross feeding data from a session to another… And tools like kayak might themselves have incentives to profile you as well. I don’t know that one particularly but in the end if you’re not giving money you’re likely giving data to someone…
Your employer likely uses TheWorkNumber, that place lets anyone have all your data. Previous employers, W2s, dependents, SSN, salaries, bonuses, benefits, address, marriage status. Its given freely to corporations because fuck you this is America and this what we voted for.
Good thing I live in Europe then
There are no borders on the internet ;)
Credit check.
They buy aggregated data from every other company and organisation in existance. That includes your purchase history and behaviour in great detail. Of course they will also have the data of your relatives and friends, which they will take in to account.
On the one hand we seem to currently have some of the cheapest air tickets the world has ever seen. If you’re willing to travel like cattle.
On the other hand it feels like air travel is now like getting on the city bus and there’s some guy vomiting in front of you and a screaming kid pissing on the seat behind you, all the while you’re getting herded around like a cow, your stuff is at high risk of getting stolen with no recourse, and the airline is playing mind games about the best time to buy a ticket after sneaking in a bunch of clauses designed to get you to pay more later.
Cheap tickets, and yet the longest travel time ever. No more showing up at the airport and walking onto the plane in less than 20 minutes anymore.
So its gonna run a soft credit check on you and then give you a price?
You don’t even need AI for that, and that’d be waaaaay cheaper to implement than AI.
…
A Delta spokesperson told Fortune the airline “has zero tolerance for discrimination. Our fares are publicly filed and based solely on trip-related factors like advance purchase and cabin class, and we maintain strict safeguards to ensure compliance with federal law.”
This is horseshit.
In Economics, the entire concept of setting specific prices for specific market demographics is literally called ‘price discrimination.’
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/p/price_discrimination.asp
Advance purchase and different seating classes literally are price discrimination, third degree.
Frequent flyer discounts would be second degree.
Overall adjusting seat costs per flight based on how full or empty that flight is, is first degree price discrimination.
…
This is like a company that sells chickens saying ‘we don’t sell chickens.’
This is just gobsmackingly false, so blatantly so that it is actually funny.
Airlines entire fucking business models are based on inventing new forms and strategies of price discrimination.
…
What this asshat is saying is only even interpretable as true if what he means is ‘we don’t directly factor sexuality, age, disability, ethnicity, legally protected classes into our pricing model.’
They of course do this indirectly by pulling a whole bunch of your meta data and then accurately inferring those things, and then discriminating against you based on that.
It is laughably easy to get around US discrimination laws in this way, megacorps have been regularly doing this for at least decade now, both when it comes to you as a consumer, and you as a potential employee or renter.
It’s only “funny” if they don’t get away with it.
Otherwise, it’s just more depressing shit to throw on the pile
I have an Econ degree so my sense of (extremely dark) humor at this point is basically:
‘billions must die, but actually’
Like I don’t know what to do at the cuts to SNAP, Medicare, and Section 8, the resumption of student loan payments, the tariffs and destruction of our farming and construction industries via ICE raids… other than just laugh.
We’re looking at Great Depression 2.0, a Holodomor-like, engineered-through-stupidity-and-malice famine.
I am at this point expecting millions, potentially tens of millions of Americans to die or be reduced to literal, actual debt slaves, or be incarcerated for crimes deriving from being forced into utter destitution… all that within this 4 year Trump term, unless there is an actual revolution.
Maybe if the Dems sweep the midterms (if Trump/the Reps even allow them to happen without massive ratfuckery) some of the bleeding can be stopped, but this situation is looking extremely fucking bad.
Oh god. I forgot about climate disasters.
Welp, alcoholism runs in my family, so, time to go look at cute puppies or something.
About half of Americans are literally debt slaves already
I know that as of 2024, its about 10 to 15% of Americans with a negative net worth.
More debt than savings/investments.
So… thats your floor for literal debt slaves.
But uh, hah hah HAH,… the housing market is now crashing.
And the vast majority of Americans have a their house as their largest… investment/debt liability.
So… yeah. Probably gonna be heading closer to 50%.
Oh right, and then also every one behind on their student loans is now getting sent to collections, grace period over…
Yeah its all fucked, so fucked I don’t even think anyone has a holistic view of all the precise data, at this point.
Overall adjusting seat costs per flight based on how full or empty that flight is, is first degree price discrimination.
Interesting. Hotels do this all the time, jacking up prices 100s of % as occupancy increases. And of course if there are events or concerts happening. Supply and demand, sure I guess. Still feels scummy.
My MIL’s health hasn’t been so great in the past year so we’ve been visiting her frequently. She also lives in a rural town whose nearest airport is served only by Delta. Can’t wait for those fuckers to notice we fly here often and stick it to our wallets.
This is so mind bogglingly insidious to actually roll out because Delta is a regional hub monopoly and major common carrier nationwide, they very well could be the market setters for this kind of AI-price scalping. Like, we’re just going to throw out the concept of serving ‘a market segment’ and trying to land on a certain price:offering ratio to capture market share via demand curve plotting, inherently leaving space both at the fringes and center for competition.
Now there is no competition. How does American or United price compare on routes or seat category, when there is no public price, but a personalized formula to maximize value extraction from each person? It’d be like trying to price compare at a close-envelope auction - you can’t.
There already is a lot of opacity in the buying process like phased seat releases creating artificial scarcity, but this is next level. I can absolutely see Delta holding back seats instead of selling them to ‘low value’ individuals who have very elastic demand, and releasing seats early/only for those who’ll pay the fees. Want peace of mind knowing you locked in your flight 6-9mo ahead? Pay up 🔫
Yep.
The more layers of the onion you peel back, the more you wanna cry.
It just gets worse the greater level of detail you look at it in.
Sounds illegal or certainly should be. I’m confident nothing will be done to stop them though. Frightening given I believe this to be one of the least evil US airlines.
Yeah, this is literally discrimination based inherently on race, gender, etc., but it’s going to be considered totally fine because the mystical AI is doing it.
When at school, I was being told this is illegal. Public offering and all that.
That is, I wouldn’t mind with something like ancap in place (to preserve things like competition and privacy), but I see no good things from ancap being implemented anywhere, while the bad things seem to not be meeting any resistance at all.
So, 1) how’s this legal, 2) … oh, have read in the comments that it’s still not. Thanks.
Delta has been by go-to airline for a long time. After reading this, I want to fly with them again. Fuck them and anyone else who does this. If we collectively do nothing to put a stop to this practice now, it will be everywhere soon. I fucking hate this level of capitalism. Greedy fucks.
Unfortunately the other big airlines in the country will do this soon after seeing its success.
Exactly. And it won’t stop with airlines either. Our entire lives are going to be a fucking auction model. That’s why we need a lot of vocal opposition now.
I travel for work and have flown a lot with all three major airlines. Delta is not the “go-to” airline. They all suck for different reasons, use what’s most convenient for you. If you travel for work, pick one most convenient most of the time and build points, but just remember each one is shit.
They sure seem to suck less than the others. American? Never. Do they just hate customers? United…if I have to.
This kind of blows my mind. Globally The top three airlines for being on time in order were: Aeromexico, Suadi, and Delta.
Experiences differ. I’ll say I’ve had more bad experiences with Delta than United. American is still the worst of the three big ones domestically. I fly United for work and will have a delay maybe once every 10 flights and I’m constantly flying and always have at least one connection.
I’ve personally had a better experience with United, than any of the others. Doesn’t mean they still don’t have issues. I just mostly picked them because of my home airport having more United gates and connecting in Denver is a more convenient “mid-point” to split my flight times.
They have been losing money on tickets for a while now
And making it up on credit card feesGuess people will be moving away from Delta then.
If this proves to be profitable, you know that the other airlines will do it.
In the US, we’ll be sure to expand it to all the other purchases we make. Eventually even buying groceries will be a shakedown of your bank account.
I’m sorry to inform you that there are already some grocery stores in America that have electronic price tags that update automatically.
Just look at surge pricing on Uber to see where this is headed
I’ve been quoted 100+ for a 20 minute ride on Uber. Needless to say I walked and waited till it was 40~. Still overpriced but still.
That’s fine. I like driving.
