I’m mainly interested in how clean it gets the dishes, and how reliable it is. I also don’t need or want any kind of internet-connected features.
I’ve got a Bosch (Serie 6) too and I’m happy with it overall.
Just one problem: It doesn’t dry my airfryer pot very well. I only got my first airfryer recently so I’m not sure if all dishwashers struggle with large non-stick coated pots.
Also here in the down under they’ve got a different product line and there are no models that can pop open their doors. IIRC it was Miele that started doing this first so I always suspected if they got into any legal trouble (didn’t do any digging, just a wild guess). Considered Miele, just way too expensive here.
Edit: Ours have touch panels tho, so fewer features are locked behind apps. IIRC in the US Bosch has more traditional control panels so e.g. you can’t adjust timers down to minutes without their app?
On a side note, I recommend not putting anything non-stick in the dishwasher. The combination of high-pressure, high-temperature jets of water, plus the surfactants in the detergent, all work together to break down that non-stick coating faster than you’d believe. You’ll seriously shorten the life—or at least the non-stick functionality—of any non-stick vessel you put in there. Hope that doesn’t sound judgy or anything—you do you—but the pan will stay non-stick longer if you wash it by hand with a non-stick-safe sponge.
Perhaps it’s just marketing talks but dishwasher-safe was literally one of their selling points (Phillips). I hope it holds up to their reputation. The pot is quite tricky to hand wash.
I did lose one or two cheap fry pans to dishwashers. But two or three years ago I got a decent Tefal. It’s ‘dishwasher-safe but hand wash if you can’. I only hand wash if it needs a good scrub though. Still going strong, and that’s good enough for me.
Anything by Bosch, but don’t cheap out. Also, the keypads are touch sensitive. There is no need to press the buttons, just set a fingertip upon them. Otherwise, you’ll wear out the buttons.
Miele, Asko, or Bosch in a pinch.
Some low end Bosch have in the past been Frigidaire or something dressed up as a Bosch. Keep an eye out for that.
I replaced my Miele (2001 build date) this year. The control panel was getting a little unreliable. It still was cleaning dishes (when it started).
This is the correct answer: https://www.bosch-home.com/us/en/mkt-product/dishwashers/top-controls/SHX78CM5N
Bosch dishwasher fucking suck, E24 errors all the goddamn time
Is your drain impeller blocked with food, or is your pump motor dying?
I got a Bosch last year, simple setup, no IoT bullshit, just works, quiet. For what it’s worth, the guy who installed it told me “I install new dishwashers and remove old ones in the process all the time. I’ve never had to remove a Bosch dishwasher”.
FWIW all Bosch dishwashers have IoT now, even the cheapest. You don’t need to use it, but at least it plays well with 3rd party stuff like Home Assistant.
Really, because I have a Bosch and I had to install the app and then use HACS to install an integration which goes through their cloud.
I don’t use that for anything more than alerts but it’s annoying it has zero local control. This is a perfect use case for Zigbee or Z-Wave and if I’m paying a premium I don’t get why I wouldn’t get premium features.
Also some features are app only (special dry modes etc) so if I want the functionality I paid for I have to be signed up for their cloud.
let’s hope they won’t just hop on an open wifi and do whatever, but hoping is the most we can do.
never had such a device, if it works with Hass (offline) that’s kind of good, but I wonder if they are hackable before connecting them to a network, because they run a hotspot or something
Get the most basic version with a metal interior. I haven’t tried many brands but my whirlpool is ok
Why a metal interior?
Holds up better, won’t crack or leak.
Quieter, too
Get the base model of whatever the consensus on brand is generally. ALWAYS research though. They all wash dishes, usually the biggest problems people have with dishwashers is user error stuff. Like not knowing you need hot water at the sink first before starting the dishwasher. which pulls from hot water pipe, but the water in the pipe is not even warm yet by the time it stops calling for water if you just start it. Same with not adding dishwasher detergent to the pre wash cycle, adding too much detergent to the main cycle spring loaded container, not accounting for hard water streaking and failing to buy a streak/rinse aid, not cleaning the filters or door seals regularly, buying a shitty detergent and not trying others, etc.
My old Bosch just died after being worked hard, and after a couple days being salty over it, I bought another Bosch. They’re quiet and do a great job.
I’ve heard some features are locked behind an app on newer low end models. Higher end models hsvd enough buttons to do everything.
My dishwasher is doesn’t need WiFi access… Like, I have my washer and dryer hooked up because getting a reminder of loads being finished is great, but the dishwasher doesn’t need anything like that.
Another vote for Bosch.
BTW, you know you’re old when you get excited about dishwasher features. I accept I’m old now.
If you can get a higher end 800 series, it has two really cool features: Crystal Dry and Eco mode
You know those silica desiccant pouches that get shipped in everything from our electronics to our beef jerky? Just by being exposed to air, the crystals absorb water. You can even reuse the crystals if you heat them and the water evaporates out. The Bosch 800 series has a large container of these type of crystals (Zeolite) in the back of the unit.
During the heating step, the container is opened allowing the hot moisture to escape. The container then closes, and the wet washing cycle begins. After the dishes are all clean, the container opens again, and the hot wet air inside the dishwasher is pushed through the desiccant container. Because its a closed system, all the water in the air and on the dishes is absorbed by the desiccant and they are bone dry ready to be put away! The desiccant lasts decades so its not like a wearable part.
This feature used to be only available on the high end Thermador Sapphire dishwashers costing a minimum of $2000. A few years ago Bosch allowed this feature in their high end models, the 800 series.
Another feature the 800 series has is “Eco mode”, which saves a lot of water and energy at the cost of a longer dishwasher cycle. Instead of using a 6 gallons of water and a huge amount of electricity to heat the water super hot (for most effective quick washing), it uses only 2.4 gallons of water and half the electricity not heating the water as much, but using that water for much longer cleaning to get the same cleaning in the end. A Eco cycle runs for about 2 hours (which the unit is crazy quiet too). The run time doesn’t bother me a bit because I usually start or schedule the dishwasher to run when I’m not in the kitchen anyway. Also yes, you can run Eco mode and have it finish with Crystal Dry.
Crystal Dry is the bomb.
Plastic comes out dry. 'Nuff said.
I echo this.
I went with a lower tier Bosch simply because it had a built-in water softener and that was my main priority. On hindsight I may have jumped for the 800 series.
The 3rd utensil tray becomes way more usable with the 800, and your stuff actually dries unlike in my model.
I will say I thought my old whirlpool that came with this house was well designed (more capacity and utensil tray being out of the way on the door was nice).
I’m excited.
Can also chime in on Bosch. Knock on wood, never any issues and no “talk to your dishes from your smartphone” IoT bullshit.
They do have that now, though. The control panel is as cryptic as ever, with certain settings only possible though divination (or a series of unlabeled button presses, I forget which).
But now some settings and wash modes are app-only. Still fully functional without an app, but frustrating I can’t use the thing to it’s fullest ability on it’s own.
This has not been my experience with the one I got a few months back.
Maybe you don’t use those settings?
https://media3.bsh-group.com/Documents/9001906312_A.pdf
Page 19, delayed start is only via app. And page 21 has the secrets to the “basic settings” that definitely requires the manual and patience to use.
Delayed start being limited to the app is horseshit.
I got a Bosch a year ago and love it. Super quiet, super clean. But my favorite feature is that it cracks the door open after running so that every has a chance to air dry. I run it at night and when I wake up everything is fury dry, even plastic containers.
I would love this feature. I have an older bosch and it just beeps like every 10 minutes crying to be opened up.
My 5-year old Samsung does this as well. Blows fans for 5 mins too.
Same. Samsung, +/- 5 years old.
This is also useful as a visual cue for “the dishwasher is finished and needs to be unloaded”. My ADHD means that visual cues like this are super helpful
Maybe in the US bosch is considered premium, but in Germany is the standard (BSH group, including bosch, Siemens, neff, etc). Their dishwashers are fine, but hard to say if better than others. But their support is awesome, you still can get replacement parts 20 years down the line, and do the repair yourself because they provide decent manuals and there’s tons of YouTube videos.
I like the IoT features, they’re so silent that it’s nice to get a notification when they are done, or start them when solar/cheap power is available.
I’ve heard good things about Miele, but don’t have any experience first hand.
Gonna make myself unpopular here. No to Bosch. Overpriced and overhyped. You pay a premium and get little in return. I installed my own and rather than just connecting the power to a standard electrical connection, you have to (or you have to pay someone) to wire in a proprietary electrical connection box. The dishwasher has a special cable that connects to their weird receptacle. No idea why, helps nothing, adds labor without benefit. Bosch dishwashers do not use heating coils to dry the dishes. They use the residual heat of the water to dry. My experience is that this is not very effective as well as slow. Some have a means to ventilate themselves (fans, mechanism to open door, etc). This helps, but adds complexity, failure points and is still slow. I gave up after my last (third one) Bosch would not clean nor dry properly after it was about four years old. Took it apart, cleaned crud out of pump and bottom end. Came to conclusion that the pump was no longer able to move water at a sufficient pressure to spray the dishes. Was more of a weak sprinkler effect. No idea why it would not dry. It never dried well from the beginning.
I have since switched to a whirlpool (kitchen aid) with a heating coil. One year in being run 2x a day and no issues so far. Dishes are clean and dry. Bought a simpler model without nonsense like wifi, apps, lights, floor projection or anything else. I run one setting: auto.I do all my own maintenance\re0aurs of all my appliances, cars, electronics, etc. As well as helping out family, friends, and where I work. I’ve dealt with a lot of dishwashers and I agree with you. If you aren’t buying commercial, just get a whirlpool (or one of the rebranded whirlpools like Maytag, KitchenAid, JennAir, and Amana). GE is pretty good as well. I’ve had a GE for the past decade and I bought it used for $25.
For most families, just get a simple one that plums in through the hot water side instead of cold and skips the water heating issue, and has a drying element, and is quiet. Noisy dishwashers are annoying.
Is a great minority take and I appreciate it thank you. Honestly, I’ve been using my parents Bosch for the last 15 months and I have not been impressed. Granted they have no clue about cleaning out the filter, and even though I informed them, they don’t remember such things. And the dishes are often left wet. Also, no one is mentioning what models they have just brands, so it’s kinda hard to make a determination since I have to assume many different models have many different features, and the guy in the YouTube video I just watched said rather than just having a basket filter some of them have an actual macerating filter that can chop stuff up and that sounds pretty appealing, but I have no idea which models have that. So I’m gonna try and figure that one out.
The receptacle thing sounds like an attempt at vendor lock in.
Bosch
I love my 6 year old siemens dishwasher. I absolutely hate my tumbledryer from siemens though.
I like the Beko we got a few years ago. They compete well with Bosch.
We got a Beko double oven and microwave 6 months ago, and I’m quite impressed with the quality for the price point.
