If you can’t understand that things have gotten far worse for Ukraine in every respect in the past two years, while hundreds of thousands of people died, and millions more had their lives ruined, then kindly take your own advise. It’s incredible how libs love to moralize while the actual tangible outcome of their actions is always nightmarish. This is what happens when people become completely disengaged from reality.
They didn’t defend themselves strongly enough when Russia invaded Crimea in 2014, and Russia then invaded again. Why would letting Russia annex more land do anything other tha encourage them to finish the job they have clearly stated was fully conquering Ukraine?
You are the one denying reality. Or shilling for Putin more likely.
You’re failing to separate “Ukraine” the concept of a nation from “Ukraine” the government from “Ukraine” the group of people. In material terms, if life as part of the Russian Federation is comparable to life as an independent Ukraine (and Crimea was doing alright when there wasn’t much fighting), what does a war accomplish? Especially a war that the Ukrainian military was always going to lose. The end result is, as Yogthos said, incredible human suffering without even accomplishing the worthless task of keeping your preferred flag flying.
Now, I don’t actually agree that Russia wants to annex all of Ukraine. I think they want to break the back of the military and annex as much of Ukraine as votes to join them, but handling the colonial occupation of a country that wants to secede (like Ukraine had been doing with Donbas) is not in its interests. That said, even if they just wanted to take over the whole of Ukraine, a negotiated peace that wins concessions for human welfare would, in every respect, be a superior result to a losing war unless you’re a dog of the west and see damage to Russia as worth throwing generations into a meat grinder.
Just be aware this poster is often posting pro-Russian, pro-China content. There’s value in other points of view and not being myopic, but if you pay attention to posting trends or look at their history, there is a clear bias and/or agenda.
That is when the war started, when they were going to take Kiev in three days and Putin has repeated the assertion that Ukraine is really “part of Russia” multiple times since then. Russia switched to the narrative of taking only Donbass when the offense was stopped and Ukraine started retaking ground.
Fascinating. So if one state doesn’t recognize another, that means that it “explicitly aims to fully annex it.” So for example, the US doesn’t recognize the government of Afghanistan, so that means the US “explicitly” aims to reinvade and fully annex Afghanistan, do I have that right?
Or maybe you meant to say that Russia implicitly suggested that it intended to fully annex Ukraine, according to your speculation?
People have the right to an opinion, and I have the right to point out the obvious idiocy of that opinion. If you have an actual counterpoint to what I said, then feel free to expound on it.
Just be aware this poster is often posting pro-Russian, pro-China content. There’s value in other points of view and not being myopic, but if you pay attention to posting trends or look at their history, there is a clear bias and/or agenda.
I enjoy how this comment seems to counter what another commenter said about you.
It’s hardly a smear to point of a bias or perspective you hold. I’m not commenting on you, your politics, or worldview. Just pointing out that others should do their own research.
But if that is smearing in your perspective, and that makes me a ‘lib’, alright.
Your repeated comment can serve literally no other purpose than ad hominem. As in, because this poster posts things you claim to be “pro-Russia” and “pro-China” therefore the information the poster posts should be considered suspect.
Well the noble defenders are currently in need of more soldiers. Go enlist now if this is the war you think it is. Do you need help finding out how to?
The places that are primarily ethnic Russian? And voted overwhelmingly to secede from Ukraine in 2014? And then have been subject to an illegal bombing campaign by Ukraine from then until October 2022?
These contradict each other.
The whole list is “Let the invader win and blame the victim” so go fuck yourself.
the victims are the people of ukraine, who are being fed to the war machine by a right wing nationalist government in the name of western hegemony
If you can’t understand that things have gotten far worse for Ukraine in every respect in the past two years, while hundreds of thousands of people died, and millions more had their lives ruined, then kindly take your own advise. It’s incredible how libs love to moralize while the actual tangible outcome of their actions is always nightmarish. This is what happens when people become completely disengaged from reality.
They didn’t defend themselves strongly enough when Russia invaded Crimea in 2014, and Russia then invaded again. Why would letting Russia annex more land do anything other tha encourage them to finish the job they have clearly stated was fully conquering Ukraine?
You are the one denying reality. Or shilling for Putin more likely.
Russia is literally in the process of fully conquering Ukraine as we speak. What part of that are you struggling to comprehend there?
The part where you think Ukraine should roll over and give up.
You’re failing to separate “Ukraine” the concept of a nation from “Ukraine” the government from “Ukraine” the group of people. In material terms, if life as part of the Russian Federation is comparable to life as an independent Ukraine (and Crimea was doing alright when there wasn’t much fighting), what does a war accomplish? Especially a war that the Ukrainian military was always going to lose. The end result is, as Yogthos said, incredible human suffering without even accomplishing the worthless task of keeping your preferred flag flying.
Now, I don’t actually agree that Russia wants to annex all of Ukraine. I think they want to break the back of the military and annex as much of Ukraine as votes to join them, but handling the colonial occupation of a country that wants to secede (like Ukraine had been doing with Donbas) is not in its interests. That said, even if they just wanted to take over the whole of Ukraine, a negotiated peace that wins concessions for human welfare would, in every respect, be a superior result to a losing war unless you’re a dog of the west and see damage to Russia as worth throwing generations into a meat grinder.
You are a moron.
Why even bother responding if that’s all you have to say?
You mean the western backed regime in Ukraine that’s kidnapping people off the street and forcing them to fight in a proxy war?
Is today opposite day?
It’s so bad that even western media admits this, maybe try engaging with reality? https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/15/world/europe/ukraine-military-recruitment.html
Just be aware this poster is often posting pro-Russian, pro-China content. There’s value in other points of view and not being myopic, but if you pay attention to posting trends or look at their history, there is a clear bias and/or agenda.
Which “they” didn’t defend themselves strongly enough in 2014? The US-installed coup government or the people of Crimea who welcomed the Russian government?
Source?
Putin’s clearest answer yet came in a speech delivered on Monday. He believes that Ukraine is an illegitimate country that exists on land that’s historically and rightfully Russian: “Ukraine actually never had stable traditions of real statehood,” as he puts it.
That is when the war started, when they were going to take Kiev in three days and Putin has repeated the assertion that Ukraine is really “part of Russia” multiple times since then. Russia switched to the narrative of taking only Donbass when the offense was stopped and Ukraine started retaking ground.
Fascinating. So if one state doesn’t recognize another, that means that it “explicitly aims to fully annex it.” So for example, the US doesn’t recognize the government of Afghanistan, so that means the US “explicitly” aims to reinvade and fully annex Afghanistan, do I have that right?
Or maybe you meant to say that Russia implicitly suggested that it intended to fully annex Ukraine, according to your speculation?
Do people not have a right to an opinion? Or are you telling us what and how we should think and believe?
People have the right to an opinion, and I have the right to point out the obvious idiocy of that opinion. If you have an actual counterpoint to what I said, then feel free to expound on it.
Just be aware this poster is often posting pro-Russian, pro-China content. There’s value in other points of view and not being myopic, but if you pay attention to posting trends or look at their history, there is a clear bias and/or agenda.
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I agree with you. Disagreement in views isn’t a comment about an individual themselves.
That doesn’t change a pattern of posting and comments that are distinctly pro-Russian, pro-China.
Please explain to the class why you keep trying to paint posting factual information about the state of the state of the world nefarious.
I love how libs always resort to smearing people instead of engaging with the actual points being made.
I enjoy how this comment seems to counter what another commenter said about you.
It’s hardly a smear to point of a bias or perspective you hold. I’m not commenting on you, your politics, or worldview. Just pointing out that others should do their own research.
But if that is smearing in your perspective, and that makes me a ‘lib’, alright.
Your repeated comment can serve literally no other purpose than ad hominem. As in, because this poster posts things you claim to be “pro-Russia” and “pro-China” therefore the information the poster posts should be considered suspect.
It’s very obvious why you made your comment and what you were trying to accomplish with it.
Join the reddit foreign legion, it is your moral duty to die for ukraine
Well the noble defenders are currently in need of more soldiers. Go enlist now if this is the war you think it is. Do you need help finding out how to?
Russia joined a civil war already in progress on the morally correct side
The places that are primarily ethnic Russian? And voted overwhelmingly to secede from Ukraine in 2014? And then have been subject to an illegal bombing campaign by Ukraine from then until October 2022?
No investigation, no right to speak.