Do you guys have higher tolerance to buggy bs? Are you all gaslighting people to get higher adoption? Does it just work? If so… How??
I’ve tried about every distro in multiple different laptops/desktops, amd gpus, basically every possible idea and there’s always weird ass bugs and issues and a ton of involuntary learning involved.
edit. Any chances you guys could suggest me one setup that “just works” no ifs and no buts? Or does it not exist in the Linux world?
edit2. Since people are asking for specifics I’m going to pick one random distro I’ve tried recently and list the issues I’ve had:
- On Arch fresh install with archinstall, everything default pmuch:
Immediately greeted with this. thread discussing it here.
I could live with that though, kinda…
Gnome apps in Arch are taking multiple seconds to open/tab back into and freezing, no idea how to debug it.
Could also live with it…
The killer one is that the battery life just sucks badly. about 15W idling with tlp, for comparison Debian with tlp gives me sub 5Watts. But again, Debian comes with a whole different set of issues.
I’ve only listed the one I’ve tried most recently, but the experience is similar with all distros I’ve tried.
Could you be more specific? What bugs have you found? What distros have you tried?
What distros have you tried?
Like, literally all of them.
What bugs have you found?
All sorts of weird bugs in different distros. it would be much easier if you asked what bugs happened in a specific distros.
But what I wanted to know is more like: I’m not trying to solve every single little bug I’ve encountered so far. What I’m looking for is a less buggy experience, does it exist in the Linux world?
Really, which issues did you have under Hannah Montana Linux?
All software has bugs. Modern “vanilla” distros aren’t especially buggy though. Install Mint or Ubuntu, if you need a network adapter make sure it supports Linux, then just use it like you would any other system.
Honestly, it just works or not works as much as other operating systems. I’ve just come to like its way of working or not working more than others. I get it. When something doesn’t work the symptoms usually let me know where to look for a fix.
By now this comes down to experience and the ability to read and understand error messages.
When I watch people online in videos messing up with Linux it usually seems to be due to them not reading correctly and ignoring vital information, skipping stuff or trying to alter some process in a misguided way. See Linus Sebastian entering “yes, do as I say” without realising that the system is trying to keep him from making a fatal mistake.
Tl;dr - Use Mint, as for other bug complaints pics or gtfo
Running the mainline distros I’ve never encountered an installation that didn’t “just work”. I’ve thrown mint on basically every device people in the family have any no one has come back to me for any software breaking bugs.
The only bug I can remember messing me personally up was a few years ago when a bad grub update stopped booting my arch machine, but that was more me than the os’s fault. Which is more than people who got bricks from CrowdStrike can say.
If you can narrow down anything beyond “bugs” and “basically all distros” you don’t want help. There’s tens of thousands of distros and an infinite number of possible bugs.
Tl;dr - Use Mint, as for other bug complaints pics or gtfo
I’ve recorded this video on Arch. But I was having the exact same issue on Mint. Also sadly on anything Debian related flatpaks are SLOW for me, like slow slow slow.
And this kind of comment is what I find so weird, it’s such a diametrically opposite experience from what happens to me. On a fresh arch install currently: Those screen artifacts, gnome apps(terminal ,nautilus etc) just randomly freeze. Usually when tabbing back to them. And quite a few crashes all around.
What are your hardware specs, are you running xorg or wayland? The video is kind of hard to see what you’re referencing beyond the screen tearing on desktop transition.
Can only speak from personal experience, sadly. Other than the self-inflicted kind (running Asahi on a MPB for example) I’ve had a more or less painless experience. Off the top I have about 9 devices running Linux (excluding Pis) and have used Linux almost exclusively for about 10 years.
I should note that bugs and the like aren’t unheard of, for example I had a friend who’s laptop refused to sleep properly - I just personally don’t have any horror stories.
What are your hardware specs, are you running xorg or wayland? The video is kind of hard to see what you’re referencing beyond the screen tearing on desktop transition.
6900hs, 6800s / 680m on that laptop and wayland. I found a “solution” to that in the arch forums but one that wrecks battery life at the same time.
You also mentioned above that you’re using Arch, and while I personally love Arch and think it’s reputation is way overblown, for better or worse it is a fairly stripped back distro and isn’t going to have a bunch of edge-case stuff built in. Now, typically Mint does so with that issue persistent across them I am more inclined to think it isn’t going to be that wasy but you might try a Pop/OpenSuse/Fedora and see if anything they’re bundled with just magically solves the issue. I suspect a live image would be sufficient for testing that
I’ve tried all of those. They solve some issues but introduce some newer issues.
Currently I’m fighting Debian trying to fix an issue where all flatpaks take about 5 seconds to open. I can’t even find a similar case on google.
Try what post #2 says? https://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?t=159418
The guys in this thread also mention checking permissions and versions https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=417949
I don’t typically use flatpaks so I am way outside my depth here.
For most people, using Linux is not a buggy experience. So no, people aren’t gaslighting you. Normally, you grab a modern release like the latest Fedora or Ubuntu and you can get a live desktop up in seconds booting from a USB stick.
Esoteric hardware can be a problem if particular driver haven’t been developed yet. That tends to hit laptops harder than desktops, but it’s much less of an issue than it used to be.
People are asking for specifics because they don’t share your experience and so can’t fill in the blanks.
I see. Since it’s a newish post I’ll update the main body with the issues I’m having with one distro for example.
Any chances you guys could suggest me one setup that “just works” no ifs and no buts? Or does it not exist in the Linux world?
You’ve given so little insight into your experience
My most recent hardware has been fine
- My framework 13 amd has worked perfectly with Fedora Kinoite.
- My Minisforum UM780XTX has been a great Steam console with Bazzite
- My desktop is a gigabyte x570 board with a ryzen 3700X and a 5700XT GPU, has been solid for years, running Fedora KDE and then Kinoite.
- My workstation at work is a HP 845 G11 and it works fine, also running Fedora Kinoite
In the past I’ve had thinkpads (an X1 carbon and a T485), also good choices
Over my 12 years of using Linux as my daily for work and home (and about 13 years of fiddling with it on and off before that), avoid realtek hardware, avoid nvidia gpus, avoid switchable graphics, avoid strange OEM feature devices. Check hardware for compatibility before you buy it. Stick to mainstream distros, not niche 1 man community distros. I’ve moved to immutable/atomic distros because they are harder to tinker with outside of user space, as historically tinkering is what got me into trouble, now I do that in a container away from my base OS.
I havent tried atomic distros yet, but they just seem painful to use. Getting different applications to interact with each other just seems difficult in them.
there is some change of workflow, but its not difficult. The benefits outweigh the changes or any perceived draw back IMHO
similarly, for me:
my desktop was a bit buggy when I was doing bleeding-edge wayland/nvidia stuff on Arch. I switched to an AMD GPU, and haven’t had issues since. I’ve since distro-hopped to Nobara, then Bazzite, then NixOS, all with no issues.
My Framework 13 laptop was good on Manjaro with no bugs and now is good on NixOS.
My 2013 Macbook Air is also bug-free on NixOS.
PEBKAC
Laptops are a crapshoot, so I’d recommend sticking with distros that are known to support your specific model.
Desktops should, in general, just work.
That said, I’ve never personally had a seamless experience. There’s always something I need to struggle to configure. Usually it’s because I’m very picky and I like things to work MY way. The alternative on Widows would not be that it works my way; it would be that there’d be no way to do that so I’d just have to deal with it. If you’re willing to just roll with the defaults, then yeah, most basic things should just work.
The biggest gotcha is GPU drivers. Not all distros ship with recent kernel versions with modern drivers. You should be pretty safe with Fedora and derivatives.
If you want an out of the box distro that just works and has that old-school flavour, maybe look into Mint.
If you want something a bit more modern, then pop_os! is something of a Linux darling
Ubuntu probably has the widest community support. Although it does seem to have some issues
I’m not clear on what your bugs are, but if it’s like, you run a command in the terminal and a bunch of scary sounding messages come up, that’s normal. That’s just how it likes to be
If it’s been a while since you’ve seen used it, then I’d say Linux is probably worth another shot. It’s come a long way, and it only gets better with age
I’m running Pop on a desktop and I’ve really enjoyed getting used to what it offers
config that just works:
- get a ThinkPad x230
- install linux mint
- set up the simplest wifi network possible (wpa2)
- connect to the wifi network
how’s the battery life on thinkpads?
I get around 10 hours of web browsing or video playback on my T480 with integrated graphics and the extended battery. It would be a couple hours longer if it had fresh batteries.
and there’s always weird ass bugs and issues and a ton of involuntary learning involved
The issue is not that Linux is more or less buggy/difficult than Windows. It’s that you’re conditioned to already understand Windows’ bugginess/difficulty. I dual-booted for some of xp, all of 7 and much of 10. I found once I got comfortable enough with both, there were perhaps slighly fewer deep problems on Windows, but they were always much more difficult to rectify.
But I understand if you don’t want to take the time to get to that point, learning isn’t for everyone.
Thereare Linux servers running that haven’t had reboots in years.
I’ve got 6.5 years before I finally locked myself out and had to reboot it, which was entirely my fault.
My desktop goes without a reboot for 40-50 days.
Genuinely curious, how do they update? My server (ubuntu) yells at me every time I ssh in to reboot “as soon as possible” because “livepatch has fixed vulnerabilities”. So if you don’t reboot, you don’t get kernel updates, and your server becomes vulnerable?
There are bugs, but they’re less annoying for me than the deliberate enshittified features that exist in current versions of windows.
That being said, I don’t run linux on a laptop, and so my experiences have probably been less buggy than yours
Do you guys have higher tolerance to buggy bs? Are you all gaslighting people to get higher adoption? Does it just work? If so… How??
I’ve tried about every distro in multiple different laptops/desktops, amd gpus, basically every possible idea and there’s always weird ass bugs and issues and a ton of involuntary learning involved.
Your question is a bit like asking ‘why do you guys all have a perfect spouse while I only get to live with that stupid creature?’.
Obviously, you would be wrong in considering both your and our own relationships like that.
As far as Linux goes, nope, we’re not more tolerant to BS or gaslighting anyone. That said, maybe you’re the one gaslighting here (yourself, at least) if you’re saying there is such a as a perfect OS?
My Linux machines (Debian/Xfce and Mint/Cinnamon, if that really matters) both have issues. Exactly like, what not-a-surprise, my Mac and my iOS devices have. They’re different issues, but they’re issues. I don’t know, say, I can’t run Affinity Designer on Linux like I easily can on a Mac (‘what a shitty OS that Linux is!’) but I also canot change all text size on the screen as easily on the Mac as I can do it on Linux (‘what a shitty OS that macOS is!’), or have a Windows laptop with as good a battery life as a M Mac…
The only serious question to ask should be: which issues are deal breakers for you, and which are not?
It’s a relatively simple checklist to do. Then, it’s a matter of asking a few questions around to confirm there is no solution available. Problem solved, you will know for sure if you can use Linux or if you cannot. No drama, no existential crisis. And, as nice bonus, no need to question anyone else intelligence and/or honesty, not even your own.
edit. Any chances you guys could suggest me one setup that “just works” no ifs and no buts? Or does it not exist in the Linux world?
‘Could you suggest a Mac that will just works? Or does it not exist in the Apple (or Windows) world?’ You can’t? And, no, you can’t, don’t believe the marketing. Because if you could Apple would certainly not need to spend the fortune it is spending on customer support and warranty repairs, and the repairman/right to repair advocate Louis Rossman would never have become the influencer he is. Macs and iPhone too have issues.
Well, neither can we help you find the perfect setup for Linux that is guarantee to work without issue ;)
Because you (still) have a lot to learn.
My experience has been quite the opposite: Windows is the one that’s constant problems for me, with no obvious way to fix and if I were to follow the common advice on the Internet I’d be reinstalling it more than I use it.
Linux has been very reliable for me. Sometimes I look at my uptime and I’m like, maybe I should reboot soon.
They’re always some initial problems just like Windows but usually once it’s all fixed up it stays that way. My install is 13 years old and still going strong.
Same for me, all the support I had for Windows was “reinstall” or “have you checked the latest version of ‘x’ driver?”. Now I can actually solve my problems or maybe someone knows how to, there’s a big community with real access to debugging tools that may be able to help.
I won’t deny that some people are annoying and don’t help at all, but you can always move to the next community or just change distros. I distrohopped using VMs because I couldn’t risk losing work in my laptop and then chose one (openSUSE Tumbleweed) which has its own problems, but I now can understand why something happens (or not).
Also, some problems that I’ve encountered are only problems for me, some people would not even care about them, but I do and that gave me the tools to help other people when they need it (mostly friends from my career trying Linux).
