Hi all!
We’re very excited to move to Denmark soon as lifelong Americans. I have a good job lined up, and we’re set on a place to live for a while.
Any advice from people who have done it, looked it up, had friends who have done it, etc? Just in general :)
I’m so, so sorry. Also, if Trump is reelected, FLEE.
We’re moving away from the US, did you misread that or are you suggesting we should flee further than Europe?
First of all, a practical item that people sometimes forget: traffic laws are different in every country. Even if your driver’s license is valid in other countries, take a moment to read up on traffic rules.
If you live in a city, give public transport a serious consideration. It’s not for everybody and not every place has good connections, but you’d be surprised how little you need a car if you live in an area well-served by public transport.
As with any foreign country, you’ll do well to learn the language. Written Danish probably isn’t too difficult to learn when you already know English (they share a heritage after all) but spoken Danish is quite peculiar. You’ll probably get by with just English just fine, but most people will prefer to speak their native language.
What I’ve heard from family moving to Denmark: check and double check your tax information and registration. The bureaucratic process can take a while, even when moving within the Schengen zone. Also: America has some weird laws where you need to pay taxes regardless of if you live there or not, as long as you’re a citizen. Make sure you know how much taxes you need to pay to what government! You generally don’t need to pay tax in both countries unless you make a boatload of money but it can’t hurt to check.
Speaking of, you’ll pay a lot of taxes. You get a lot in return, but make sure you know what your net income is going to be like and what taxes are hiding around the corner. The amazing Danish welfare state needs to be funded somehow!
If you live near any borders (European definition of “near”), check any visas you may have for what you’re allowed to do. Some visas allow you to move freely within a single country but not leave it for x amount of days consecutively/in a year, for instance. Denmark is actually one of the few countries with border checks (Germany too these days).
What I’ve heard from other Americans visiting Europe: it’s smaller than you think and everything seems closer than you think. That’s very nice when it comes to stuff like grocery stores, but some people feel a little claustrophobic because of the lack of free, open space.
Make sure your credit card is set to allow for international payments, unless you already have your money in a Danish bank account. You don’t want to arrive and find out you can’t pay for anything.
Get yourself a local SIM card. It’s probably a lot cheaper than carrying your American number in general, but roaming charges between the US and the EU are Not Fun.
Most Danes speak English well, in my experience. However, don’t let that fool you into thinking they share the same cultural norms. Things common in some American subcultures (calling everyone “dear”, saying stuff like “we should hang out some time” without actually meaning it) can cause some humorous/awkward interactions when misinterpreted. Knowing the words isn’t the same as knowing what you actually mean!
Prepare to do a lot of currency conversions in your head. You can get tricked into spending more money than you thought if you don’t know what amount of DDK translates to USD. 1 USD is about 6.8 DDK, so yeah, good luck with that, multiply by seven and subtract a bit I guess?
Stores in Denmark will often show prices including tax, so don’t do too much mental math. You generally don’t need to apply the 25% VAT on listed prices unless you’re buying business to business.
Based on experience from expats: immerse yourself into the local culture and language. Making connections with strangers is hard, likely harder than in the US, but you’ll end up quite lonely if you only hang out with coworkers and other expats.
Also read up on punctuality expectations. Some cultures expect you to be five minutes to half an hour “late” to an agreed upon time, others expect you to be there much earlier, and then other cultures expect you to arrive right on time. That applies both professionally and socially!
On a similar note, make sure you read about the expectations your coworkers may have of you, culturally. If you work for an American company you may end up with an American style corporate hierarchy, but Danish companies are a lot more egalitarian on average. Not just office wise, but also “only addressing the boss by their first name” wise.
Working overtime may not be appreciated as much, and may even be seen as a bad thing in some contexts (i.e. constantly working after 5PM to finish your work, implying you can’t finish in time when you’re really trying to show your work ethic or something like that). Work/life balance is important and every country has different standards.
From what I can tell, the Danes are quite strict in not wanting to spend too much of their life working, so don’t be that person that brings work into every conversation. As a foreigner, you probably have much more interesting topics to talk about!
I’ve only head good things about Denmark from people who worked/moved there, so I hope you enjoy your time there!
Yeah, this is all great advice. I work for a very European style company in the US and will work for a Danish company in Denmark. So I’m not expecting total culture shock (like our CEO currently wears a T-shirt and sneakers, you can have a beer with him) like going to Japan would be, but also looking forward to less work focus.
Yeah, the mental math of money, units, will all be a lot. But we’ll get used to it!
I’m stoked for the smaller, car-free, perhaps simpler life.
Wait, stores display prices in the US without the tax? Wth? That can’t be!
It’s definitely a thing.
Which tax? Federal? State? County? City/Municipality? What if some of those are zero?
This is why no one does it. I think smart labels may change that some day, but I wouldn’t hold my breath.
Edit: ah, to be clear, those tax types can all vary. I used to shop at a place where the same store on the opposite side of the street was cheaper because the tax rate was less.
They know the price to charge at the till so they definitely can show the full price. It’s just convention not to at this point. Why go through the effort when it only makes you look more expensive compared to the competition, after all?
The reason usually mentioned is that the labels are produced centrally or some such. Though "They know the price to charge at the till’ might be slightly off when the tax is calculated on the transaction as a whole rather than on a per-item basis (i.e. rounding shenanigans). That seems like a totally solvable problem to me, though.
I took my wife to meet my parents and had to remind her when we went shopping that we had to add tax to everything (and tip in bars/restaurants/etc.) Some things looked cheaper than in Japan until tax (especially at that time when the exchange rate was awful).
Sending the labels from a central location seems wildly inefficient when label printers are as cheap as they are.
Plus, prices are already adjusted at the state level at the very least, if you’re gonna ship every store their labels from a central location you may as well update the tax info on them.
Even the budget stores here are switching to a digital display system with those small e-ink displays. When that technology hits the US, there really won’t be an excuse not to label things including tax anymore.
When I was last in the US, most of the supermarkets and such had the eink displays, but most other places didn’t yet.
Then there really are no excuses left for those supermarkets. Just a weird Americanism, like using imperial units.
I mean I guess stores in places with 0% sales tax don’t, technically. American stores just don’t want to bother doing the math while labeling and make you do the math in your head (and then they do it at the till).
Another consequence of the crazy American tax system.
If you work for an American company you may end up with an American style corporate hierarchy, but Danish companies are a lot more egalitarian on average. Not just office wise, but also “only addressing the boss by their first name” wise.
That’s been a thing in the USA for decades.
It’s a bit hard to articulate the difference I’ve noticed with Americans when talking about work. It’s not like America is stuck in the 60s with executive toilets and executive lunches, but office culture definitely seems different.
What probably makes a difference is the difference in management styles.
expats
The word is “immigrants” but Brits and Yanks are scared to call themselves that lol
Most expats leave after a few years. They only move in to make a quick buck with tax advantages and then move back/on to another country.
I suppose they’re a form of immigrant, but a very specific subgroup. One that often also doesn’t intend to integrate with local culture, so their approach is quite different from most legal immigrants. You can’t really compare the experiences of war refugees with Americans that come work in another country for five years, even though they’re both forms of immigrants.
I don’t just consider the Brits and Americans to be expats, I’ve also met expats from eastern Europe, India, and South East Asia. Maybe the rich expats don’t like to be grouped together with them, but I also consider the cheap eastern European labourers that do jobs like working the fields for half a year to be expats.
Since you are moving to Denmark: flee! Take a car and drive north to seek refuge in Sweden. Once you make it there you are safe, but you never know, the Danes could invade any minute. Keep driving north until you start seeing reindeer walking around like they own the place. Move into a cabin in the woods and never look back. The Danes can’t reach you there.
We don’t really have to worry about the Danes invading. We can just move the inventory of all the Systembolaget stores in Scania to other parts of Sweden so they won’t get long.
It’s a trick. There are no roads north out of Denmark.
It’s worth it. I’m almost two years in Germany. Wouldn’t move back for a million dollars (although at 3 I could be bought). Work on the local language, volunteer or other community involvement activities, treat it like the new home it is. We’re fortunate to be able to move to a new country, try to be a part of improving it and earning your spot there. I’m even more fortunate to be white, male, straight etc - assuming you’re at least some of those things, do your best to counter the anti-immigration fear mongering that comes out of the political right. It effects you now, but more importantly it’s ramping up and it’ll effect people less fortunate far worse.
Hope you love it and welcome to Europe.
That’s great advice. I’m really excited to experience it and really embrace it. Thank you!
Don’t bring a truck or guns with you. Change some dollars for euros. Remember that the US has an insane tax system that follows you abroad and you still have to file taxes in the US in addition to the country you live in.
yes, be very careful of PFICs. I can’t use any of Japan’s versions of ISA/IRA because they all end up being PFICs which are awful to deal with on the US and more than destroy any tax advantage of putting money in them.
Those Euros will not be a lot of use in Denmark, a country outside of the Eurozone.
Does Denmark even use cash at all? In Sweden cash has been pretty much extinct for at least a decade.
Depressing if true. Using cash lets us keep the transaction out of the records of the government & tech firms.
In the middle now.
Wife is already Swedish so I’m doing it on easy mode, plus job is remote.
Politeness, wow, that’s tough to get used to. Trying to fix my silicon valley manners and I’m still coming off as the biggest asshole.
Government is more involved in your life, but it’s not too bad, just something you get used to, ups and downs, they mostly try to help.
Amazon is shit, thats a thing for me, but you manage.
They have a food culture.
No, you may have misunderstood me, I did not say they have food in their culture, I mean a significant part of their societal culture revolves around food.
Did not understand this, used to Door dashing and eating to get by, they don’t do that, food matters to them, spending half a day cooking is just a thing you do, it’s not work to them anymore than watching YouTube is.
Otherwise you’ll get by, just try to tone down your socialization reflexes, they’re more reserved and our outgoing nature can scare them shitless if they’re not ready for it.
Don’t walk in the bike path.
4th. of July is celebrated in Rebild, which could be a nice excuse to drive through the country and meet other Americans in Denmark.
Pilsner Urquel is a damn fine beer.
And from Czech, not Denmark. Are you thinking of Carlsberg? Mikkeler is the brand you recommend to people going to Denmark
Czechia is where I learned to love it, but I found it in Austria, Germany and the Netherlands as well.
I don’t have any advice, but there is something I can say. Next generation UE, investigate it
Why?
Dane here, living in the UK but have lived in the US and spent a lot of time with Americans.
First of all make sure your are looking at Forskerordningen, which can radically lower your tax burden as a foreign worker coming to Denmark.
Second, binge watch YouTube - there’s a lot of content of Americans moving to Denmark and most of them are full of advice. Travelin’ Young is the most nuanced.
It’s very easy to navigate stores and big cities with English. Do not let that fool you. Danes REALLY appreciate arrivals learning the language and there are many places where not knowing the language will really impact you. Also, language is culture and it’s too easy in Denmark to fool yourself into thinking it’s not a problem for you. You won’t really live there and make those connections without speaking the language. Learn the language; I cannot say this clearly enough. It’ll make an ENORMOUS difference to you.
Danes are very direct compared to Americans. Especially in the work place. They find Americans phoney and saccharine and they do not like corporate lingo. Speak plainly, be clear, feel a little “rude” (as an American) and you’ll quickly zero in on the right level of directness. It will be extremely difficult for you, as an American, to not read Danes as bored or rude. They are just plain.
Be advised that “provinsen” (the outskirts) is quiet, dull, won’t speak English and very bare. If you’re not living in a big city, be prepared for an uphill climb. On the upside, though, if you built relationships out there, they’ll last a lifetime.
If you want to be fully “adopted”, be advised that alcohol is part of the culture. Most events include alcohol. Sobriety isn’t normal.
If you have kids, steel yourself for the liberty danes afford their children - and expect others to give them too. Kids will roam and being exposed to risk is seen as healthy part of growing up, including in state schools.
Janteloven is real. If you’re ambitious, be strategic about how you expose that to others.
That is indeed quite accurate and comprehensive.
And as a Dane due to move back after 8 years abroad it feels strangely relevant and slightly alienating 🙃
Just dont pull a gun when some gets unauthorized on your property.
I don’t know if Denmark does it, but Norwegians love to use week numbers in corporate/education environments for scheduling instead of using dates like normal people, so you might end up in a situation where you have to check the calender to find out what date Monday week 42 might be.
… and once you’re used to it, you’ll realise how much easier that is :)
I’ve lived almost my entire life in Norway, and I don’t think it’s much easier than saying a date
- learn the language AND CUSTOMS
- don’t hang out in foreigner/english bubbles
- don’t assume anything works the way it does in the US (from gasoline and driving to medical to government). There are lots of little things that seem like they obviously must be done X way but aren’t in other countries
- be careful with any investments. It’s very easy to end up with PFICs which are punitively taxed (making retirement vehicles here in Japan outside of the national pension prohibitive for me, for instance).
- celebrate
- bring any snacks that you can legally bring but they can’t legally sell (some things with food dyes, etc. if you really like them are banned in some countries to produce/sell but not eat).
I got to disagree with the “learn the language and customs” thing. I live (also born and raised) in one of the most culturally diverse cities in America: Germantown, Maryland. I couldn’t be prouder, and I also couldn’t care less if you don’t speak English.
Be yourself. You are welcome here.
That probably depends on the country, but I don’t think you should omit learning language, even as English native, even if everyone around you speak your native one.
I’ve seen that several times already in Poland. Been around a guy from India who was practically monolingual English speaker (his local language is fading away, he should technically still speak it due to his grandparents, but doesn’t or speaks very little) and he straight up refused to learn Polish because he „seen no value” in it, it’s not an easy language to learn and he’d rather just put that time and effort into a MMO game. He only attended lessons to learn to pass an exam that will allow him staying in the country, with no intention to actually learn how to speak. Poles are quite often excited to speak English with somebody as everyone knows importance of it and wants to practice IRL. Everyone around him, like his gf, her family, coworkers in corpo, accept that and they all speak English well, so no obligation on his side. He only knows how to tell cashier that he’ll pay with a debit card and it takes a single word. Well, that’s his choice you can say, but then it was pretty annoying at times to have him around. Imagine standing in a circle joking around and every two sentences that guy asks „What? What did he/she say?”, and someone attempts to translate it to English, but the joke doesn’t work or is not understandable even after translating because it refers to something else in the language, culture, memes, slang etc. Either learn it or expect to be disconnected and excluded at times. That’s all good to tolerate newcomers who don’t yet know much about the culture and language, but it doesn’t look very good to me if that’s a guy who lives here for 8 years and doesn’t have plans moving away anytime soon.
The EU isn’t the US.
Most countries in Europe have this idea of integration where the foreigner learns and adopts the language and culture of the country. You’ll see lots of discussions of “failed” integration of foreigners, especially in Germany.
I think this is still a type of colonialism where they think there culture is better and the foreigner must change, rather than the other way around.
I think the US is a bit better in this regard as there is this idea of a cultural mixing pot and foreigners aren’t expected to “integrate”.
White people moving across the world, imposing their language and culture, is a “cultural mixing pot” ? Did you play a uno reverse card lol
It’s not colonialism to prefer one culture (or certain cultural traits) to another. In fact, it’s natural.
I’ve lived in a number of countries and each had their own distinct cultural norms. Each has had aspects which I perceived as either positive or negative.
Add it all together and I definitely have preferred certain cultures, not because they are “better” but because they more closely match my own preferences. Other people would prefer different cultural norms.
The integration part is because we would like for anyone to fit in, and not be confined to your ‘hood’
We don’t mind you not speaking the language, but English is usually not a first language, sometimes not even a second, and sometimes omitted. Especially in rural areas.
So yeah, it’s nice if we can actually have a conversation about the local soccer team, or town buffoon who thinks the government is conspiring about pricing covid shots too high…
It’s not just communicating, it’s also stuff for general living, like recognizing road signs, paying bills, dealing with government paperwork, ordering food in restaurants, etc. They won’t always have an English translation beside it, nor do they have an obligation to have it. Same goes for people too.
Say for example, a Japanese just showed up in your hometown, knowing not a lick of English, and planning to live here long term. I’m sure people in your hometown are more than willing to help, but how much stuff in your general life is in English? Surely you can’t expect someone to be able to help them around 24/7, and with a language barrier too.
You gotta know that not everything is going to accommodate for you in foreign places. OP might be able to do well enough since people in Denmark probably speak English well in general. But if you want to truly know the people, their culture, or even form deep connections with some, you have to do some work, and language is a first big step.
This is the absolute worst advice for coming to a European country. It’s probably different in Denmark but for some countries or cities at least you won’t be able to get through the bureaucracy needed to legally immigrate without speaking the language. Even in offices that mainly help foreigners you may find the employees don’t speak English. And if you want to be there long-term, good luck making real connections if you don’t speak the language.
- Language is by far the most important door opener, so put in one hour of learning every day for at least a year.
- Mingle to get out of your comfort zone: Go to after-work parties and flea markets, take public transit. Use hobbyist/ meet-up apps. Read/ watch the local news.
- Don’t expect to be invited, especially not to people’s homes. People might also be uncomfortable being invited to your home. Meeting in a public place is almost always the better option, unless you’ve gotten to know someone really well.
- Irony/ sarcasm don’t translate very well between cultures.
- Europe has some lousy weather, so get watertight coats and waterproof your shoes and backpacks.
- Take it slow.
- Also: Enjoy it! Europe is a fantastic little place at the crossroads between Asia and Africa and I would never want to leave.
UK inhabitant here. Is being invited to someone’s house a casual thing in the US? I don’t think I’ve ever been invited by someone who isn’t a close friend.
Greece here, we invite people to our homes all the time, even if we don’t know them very well.
I lived in Italy and Germany and it does happen here. Mostly with friends you already know reasonably well though.
All of this sounds so exciting. Thanks for the reply.
All round great advice. For a bit more silly one: record yourself opening the window for the first time in Denmark.
(iykyk)
