• fruitycoder@sh.itjust.works
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    10 months ago

    I feel like this calls for the importance of not just inundation but actual education for kids.

    We basically let a whole generation have the relationship with the most common and arguably valuable be defined by advertising companies.

  • 🇨🇦 tunetardis@lemmy.ca
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    10 months ago

    As a Gen X, I think my typing speed peaked around late high school/early university? I tried to teach myself touch typing and got moderately proficient. Then I got into programming where you need to reach all of those punctuation marks. So my right hand has drifted further to the right over the years, which is better for code but suboptimal for regular text.

    One thing that’s really tanked for me though is writing in cursive. I used to be able to take notes in class as fast as the prof could speak. Now I can scarcely sign my own name.

    • barsoap@lemm.ee
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      10 months ago

      So my right hand has drifted further to the right over the years,

      That should literally never be the case. How do you even find your home position like that.

      The quick and simple way to learn proper touch tying is simple: Use a typing tutor program. It really is all about writing random stuff without looking at your keyboard, that’s all there is to it, depending on layout what you write may make more or less sense. Do that until you can actually type blindly, if you need a refresher for symbols then do that, it’s worth the time investment, just for the love of everything don’t look at your keyboard and don’t ever rest your index anywhere but where you feel that they’re in the right position. Not some feel-good “feel” but those nubs on the keys (f and j on qwerty). feel them.

      • MelodiousFunk@slrpnk.net
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        10 months ago

        for the love of everything don’t look at your keyboard

        Signed,
        Xennial who was in IT for 25 years and never learned to touch type

      • 🇨🇦 tunetardis@lemmy.ca
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        10 months ago

        You know, I’m not actually quite sure what I’m doing, but I can tell you I am not looking at the keyboard. I suppose it’s similar to how I play violin? I don’t look at where my hand is but it shifts to different positions depending on what makes the most sense for the pattern I’m trying to play, and yes, a different position does imply a different fingering to reach the same notes.

        When learning to program, I initially tried to follow the touch typing guidelines, but they say that you should use the right pinky to reach every key towards the upper right end of the keyboard, which gets old fast given how frequently you need to access them. And just as with music, there are patterns. In programming, you may frequently need to type {}, :=, or even something like \{\}, and flailing around with the pinky is a good way to give yourself carpal tunnel. So your right hand learns to shift to hit those keys using a combination of fingers.

  • ruckblack@sh.itjust.works
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    10 months ago

    I mean, as a millennial, I mostly taught myself to type. I’m fast enough, but have bad technique and could be faster. I was only ever actually trained to type in grade school, and barely. Once in a while in computer class we would play an educational typing game.

    My mom is much better at typing than I am, because she was trained to type in college. That’s not really a thing anymore.

    • Anatares@lemmynsfw.com
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      10 months ago

      I learned by playing StarCraft on 56k modem. VoIP was not possible so you had to type fast. Style is wildly non-standard but i was typing fast enough not to see a benefit from standard style.

    • Captain Aggravated@sh.itjust.works
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      10 months ago

      I had typing tutor software on the family PC. It made the mistake of trying to teach typing by starting with only home row keys, then expanding outward from there. So for a very long time, you would type things like adj daf jal ls; dal fka and so forth. It was a very long time until you really started to get it.

      And then MSN chat rooms and messenger happened to me, and suddenly touch typing was the main way I had to hit on chicks. I knew what the home row was, so I knew what touch typing looked like, so I started actually doing it, but typing things I wanted to type. I’m now the third fastest typist I know. On a good keyboard with a passage I’m familiar with I can key 106WPM, right now typing conversationally out of my brain I’m probably hitting about 65 or 70.

  • Ibuthyr@discuss.tchncs.de
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    10 months ago

    People who know nothing more than how to operate a smartphone are not tech savvy. They can’t even do that properly. Never seen anyone from that generation use an ad blocker or revanced or anything else that combats enshittification.

  • octoturt@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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    10 months ago

    once again the divide between being tech-savvy and tech-native rears it’s ugly head. no, gen z is not exceptionally tech-savvy compared to previous generations, i can confirm most of my peers are tech morons. they’ve just been raised with smartphones and therefore know that specific UX language better than previous generations

  • Pika@sh.itjust.works
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    10 months ago

    the entire stereotype that gen Z is amazing at technology is overrated, it’s the same as the millennials there’s some people who have excellent troubleshooting skill and are able to use technology with very little issue, and then there’s some that you can tell that they operate technology strictly on memorization not actually understanding how it works. You can differentiate the two by modifying their environments slightly and seeing if they struggle to figure how to do the stuff they normally do.

    It’s actually more likely that with how user friendly environments are, that gen Z is less Savvy when it comes to using technology then the Millennials due to the fact that they’ve been pampered into environments that don’t require them to think outside the box, when I worked in the customer service field, it leans towards technical service and most of my customers who requested help were either Boomer or Gen Z, Millennials overall seemed to have the troubleshooting skills to be able to figure out problems without involving a third party.

    That being said like above, this was a person to person basis I did have some Boomers who were able to rock the kiosks or have the troubleshooting the skills to be able to do it; just as I had gen Z that was able to rock the kiosk as well I’m just stating my observation of what usually happend.

    Then to address the keyboard skills, most of what gen Z uses is going to be touchscreen, the desktop / laptop is a dying technology as a primary device for the younger kids as a whole, my sister didn’t even have one until she entered College(outside of a school laptop) because she just used her mobile phone or tablet, neither of those required a keyboard outside of an on-screen which you can’t use with the home system layout that used to be taught in school. So it’s only natural that gen Z might have fallen behind in keyboard skills

  • Lvxferre [he/him]@mander.xyz
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    10 months ago

    As others highlighted this is not surprising given that Gen Z uses phones a lot more than computers, and writing in one is completely different than in the other.

    [Discussion from multiple comments ITT] It’s also damn slower to write in a phone screen, simply because it’s smaller - you need a bit more precision to hit the keys, and there’s no room to use all the fingers (unlike in a physical keyboard).

    Swiping helps, but it brings up its own problems - the keyboard application needs to “guess” what you’re typing, and correcting mistakes consumes time; you need to look at the word being “guessed” instead of either the keyboard or the text being written, so your accuracy goes down (increasing the odds of wrong “guesses”); and eventually you need to tap write a few words anyway, so you’re basically required to type well two ways instead of just one to get any semblance of speed.

  • StinkySocialist@lemmy.ml
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    10 months ago

    As a younger millennial it surprises me how little others seem to get the generation divide here. Personal computers and keyboards were very common for millennials to grow up with in the house, but I think more and more people these days don’t use desktops or laptops that often most people stick with tablets and smartphones. Gen z probably doesn’t have the same keyboard skills as millennials because of that, but on average they are definitely better with tech than we are. Their typing skills are just on phone keyboards lol. Just my 2 cents

  • AllHailTheSheep@sh.itjust.works
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    10 months ago

    I’m a programmer. I write hundreds of lines of code a day (of varying levels of quality ofc). I also fix technology (phones, laptops, desktops. tablets, etc). I’m probably one of the most “tech-savvy” people I know. I very rarely type faster than 70 wpm. it’s just not necessary for what most of us are doing.

  • Johnmannesca@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    I agree the ‘tech-savvy’ phrase has outdone its use. We should use a better phrase, like ‘tech-indoctrinated’ or ‘tablet-fed’ to give a better perspective into these younger kids’ digital lifestyles.

  • Apalacrypto@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    Gen-X here with 2 Gen-Z kids. I developed my typing skills playing MUDS in the early 90’s. My kids are….ok….at typing, and despite my guidance over the years, are really bad at troubleshooting though when something goes wrong. It should “just work” to them. If it doesn’t, then the solution is to replace it.

    However, I WILL SAY…my typing speed is about 100-110 WPM on a keyboard, and that my daughter could probably match that speed typing on her phone.

    • ShepherdPie@midwest.social
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      10 months ago

      I’d also argue that your WPM typed on a keyboard doesn’t make you tech-savvy either. 1950s secretaries could type fast on a typewriter and that didn’t make them tech savvy either.

      • BreadstickNinja@lemmy.world
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        10 months ago

        There are a wide range of computer skills. Being able to interact with a word processor extremely efficiently is a highly valuable tech skill. Someone who knows about processor architecture but can’t touch type is arguably more tech-savvy but also less useful in most office jobs. So I’d say that the secretaries were indeed tech-savvy in a way that was useful for their positions.

      • flashgnash@lemm.ee
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        10 months ago

        It’s a pretty good indicator. If you spend all day working with computers chances are you’ll be able to type quickly

      • masterofn001@lemmy.ca
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        10 months ago

        I don’t even know how fast I can type on a phone.

        Even with word completion I find myself hesitating between the choice of word or typing it out.

        I know it’s not near as fast as on a physical keyboard where is used to be around 90-120 wpm if I remember correctly. (Been a while since I had to do that at an employment agency)

        Anyway, it’d be fun to see a thumbs only tiktok/Snapchat typer vs a mechanical typewriter type off.

        And, tbf, most people are far from tech savvy.

        Most are consumers. Some are really good consumers. Some are power users. Some know how to do things.

        Very few actually understand it.

        But, there was a time where there was indeed a necessity if you used the tech, you had to understand it.

  • nednobbins@lemm.ee
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    10 months ago

    I think that true “tech-savvyness” isn’t really a generational thing.

    Some people are just really curious about how stuff works. When they see something they aren’t satisfied with, “Just do it.” or “Shit just works.” They want to know how and why it works. When you hand those people a computer, machine or flower they’ll poke at it and try to understand it better.

    It’s not clear that typing skills are actually needed for that.

    I max out at around 80-100 WPM but I only sustain that when I’m transcribing something. When I need to learn about technology, it’s much more about reading than typing. When I actually need to do some coding, I spend much more time staring at the screen and looking up stuff on Stackoverlow than I do actually typing.

    Most of Z is not savvy at all, just like with every generation. And just like with every generation, some of them will push the envelope of technology. I doubt that lack of typing will slow those folks down.

  • nyan@lemmy.cafe
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    10 months ago

    Keyboard typing is a manual skill distinct from tech savvy and has to be taught as such. You’re not going to learn it by dealing with a touchscreen swipe “keyboard”. I’ve known a fair number of programmers who were two-finger typists because they were too busy taking CS courses to learn to type.

    On the gripping hand, my early-Boomer mother, who learned on typewriters, can type fast and accurately but is quite technophobic.