I’m thinking about building a desktop with one of my kids and I would really prefer to put Linux on it. My wife is not a fan of the idea, however.
I’m wondering are there any good Linux distros/utilities for children that include parental control features and things like that? And that are easy to use for a child who has only used basic Chromebooks in the past?
For reference the child is under 12.
One thing I’d like to suggest is get most of their forward facing apps as Flatpak and let them install software that way instead of using the system package manager (even if it has a GUI). This jibes with others suggesting an immutable base system.
Obviously this may be more of a concern for older kids, but my kid started with Linux and it did fine… Right up until Discord started breaking because it was too old and they didn’t want to tangle with the terminal. Same thing when Minecraft started updating Java versions. Discord and Prismlauncher from Flatpak (along with Proton and Steam now) would have kept them happier with Linux.
As for internet, routers come with parental controls these days too, which have the added advantage of being able to cover phones (at least while not on mobile data). Setting the Internet to be unavailable for certain devices after a certain time on school nights may be a more straightforward route than DE tools.
On Ubuntu (and I assume Debian), Discord will just direct you to a .deb file it needs you to install. Not the most elegant solution, but updates do work reliably. Other programs do the same.
It does that everywhere, even on non .deb distros.
Wouldn’t this be a usecase for a immutable distro? Cannot really break it? But haven’t used one myself yet so not sure how that holds up.
Let the break it, and like other things in life, make (teach) them fix it if they want to keep using it.
If you dont have an admin account you cannot break the core system anyways.
I agree that rpm-ostree based distros are awesome here, but Linux Desktops are not made to be locked down.
Yes. And using restricting application access doesn’t really work with normal package managers, but is easy with flatpak.
I bet that a kid with no root access or sudo permission couldn’t break any Linux system, immutable or not…
I can confirm. My little ones have been running Linux for years.
but then they won’t be able to install apps
Flatpaks can be installed without root access. It’s how the Steam Deck is usable despite the root filesystem being immutable by default.
oh wow, didn’t know that
Gnome itself is embedded with parental control and you can enable it while adding a new user
I don’t know how other DEs deal with it, but I think all of them has something similar, tho
Edit: also may be a good idea set a AdGuard to set a DNS block for some origins… AdGuard gives you the capability to block several apps and you can customize blocks as well
ElementaryOS comes with parental controls iirc
It does! You can limit screen time, filter websites, and block apps from running. I’m not sure how well they work because I’ve never used them though
That sounds like exactly the kind of thing I’m looking for. She’s not great at managing her electronic time yet and she needs some guardrails to make sure she’s not staying up all night watching YouTube videos and things like that.
But I also want to give her the opportunity to learn and explore
If you search for “Screen Time & Limits” on their site you can get a preview.
I’ve been running elementary as my daily driver for years with few issues, so I definitely recommend! Make sure to try out the safety settings on a live cd first though, I can’t verify how the limits work for sites and apps
They live up to their name!
I abhor the idea of things made “for kids”. I learned to program when I was 10 on a Commodore 64. And we would wear an onion on our belt which was the style at the time… Sorry, where was I?
I’d just install a normal distro. Let the kiddo break shit and learn to fix it. Keep backups for recovery and probably isolate the system on your network for if/when kiddo does something stupid. Talk about security, being responsible, etc. We learn through mistakes not by playing in safe walled-gardens.
I learned to program when I was 10 on a Commodore 64. And we would wear an onion on our belt which was the style at the time… Sorry, where was I?
Totally get that, but we live in a much more dangerous and predatory computer landscape these days. It would be foolish not to take some precautions.
True, but nothing beats out active parenting and communication. Like has been said, you can set up filters all day long (and you should), but the second the kid learns how to install a distro from scratch, they’ll soon have unfettered access the the entire Internet. The only sensible approach is to talk with them about what’s out there, the dangers of it, and how to navigate the internet safely. Also too, browse with them. Spend time with them guiding them on the wonderful parts of the internet, and help them develope good habits on being a good netzien. Eventually they’ll find the seedy parts of the internet, but hopefully by then they’ll be less interested in it because it isn’t taboo, it’s just wrong.
I appreciate your input, I was also teaching myself to code by the time I was in middle school, but this is a different situation and some guard rails are needed to manage screen time and app usage, etc.
I’m not so much worried about her wrecking the computer and more about her wrecking her brain with unfettered access to the Internet
Does it need to be connected to the internet? At that age, I think you could get away with installing stuff locally that they could play with.
IMO you should create guard rails that you intend her to eventually understand and circumvent. Nothing is more empowering for a kid interested in tech than thinking they figured out how to get around the guard rails. Just make sure you can detect when it has happened.
Do something locally on the machine to block internet access. Maybe something as simple as turning off the network adapter. One day she’ll either learn enough about the system to remove the guard rails, or she’ll find other interests.
Personally, I’d use the router to limit access to locations and times. It’s more reliable, easier to do, and lets you be less picky with your distro.
Using a DNS level content blocker like Adblock DNS is a great option, IMHO, and is super easy to setup.
(For the record, parent of 8 and 11 yr olds)
Which isn’t a bad idea, but I’d still want some kind of parental controls like Android has to limit screen time. I don’t need Netflix.com to be all or nothing, but I certainly don’t want it to be four hours a day either.
Having your router limit internet connectivity time is effectively the same thing these days. There are some things they can do offline but not much anymore.
That’s exactly right. My kids’ VLAN goes down at 8pm every night, and they are aware of it. So much so that they usually just shut down at around 7:30pm and start asking for dinner.
Evidently, I audit their network usage regularly and if I find anything concerning, I sit down with them and my wife and talk about it (have found 1 instance in which my boy was looking for pirated games for Linux, and my daughter was looking for “pranks for school and how not to get caught” 🤣).
All in all, I think we nerds have an easier shot at parenting than most people.
As a father of three, the best parent filter is oversight, communication, and guidance. People want plug and play automatic parenting on the devices their kids use, but the honest truth is nothing beats actually talking to the kids about what’s out there, the dangers, the consequences, and guiding them as they explore. Keep an eye on what they do, and intervene if they start down the wrong rabbit hole. Good luck my friend.
The thing about that is that I’m convinced the computer itself should be completely normal, it’s just internet access that should be monitored (up until a certain age). Take a look at the creepy shit kids posting at r/teenagers have to deal with, or the abuse that goes down in seemingly safe Discord servers.
If I ever have kids and they want to see what happens when they delete /etc, I’ll encourage them (assuming I took care of backups). Let them mess around with Scratch or C or Javascript or whatever. The software on the computer is the safest part of interacting with a computer these days.
I agree on just installing some normal distro, but it shouldn’t be left completely unmonitored when it comes to websites. I wish the internet I experienced as a kid was still around, but it isn’t, and that sucks.
This was my fathers approach when I was growing up. I was basically allowed to do whatever I wanted offline. But, outside of a small handful of websites (a couple gaming websites maybe), everything online needed his permission. This gave me a really solid understanding of how things worked, troubleshooting, etc, while also not letting me see anything too heinous.
Son, is that you? I had a linux machine setup for my kids with a reverse proxy. I let them have a handful of websites that were whitelisted and they could go directly to. Everything else was off limits unless I ok’ed it and added it to the list. It still boggles my mind at the scoffs I would receive from other parents, and even my spouse at the time.
Fedora apparently has some functionality.
There is also an arch wiki page on the subject.
Linux systems are used all over for enterprise use cases, which means there is a robust user permission system. Usage won’t be Googleable with stuff like “parental control” but more likely keywords like “user restriction”.
Not sure if you mention your wife because she knows Linux and thinks it’s a bad idea, or because doesn’t know Linux, and still thinks it’s a bad idea.
Of course, when your kid one day learns to flash an iso onto a usb, and install an OS, any and all parental control will be symbolic. Hopefully you’ve successfully taught your kid how to use tech safely by then.
You’ll want to look into browser extensions and blocking websites on your router, as well.
If the child is really young, check out the sugar desktop environment. There is an official distro from sugarlabs and there is also a fedora spin (fedora soas)
If the computer should be a little more functional, the GNOME desktop or the Deepin desktop are good options imoI’m doing trisquel on a sugar toast for my 5 year old and she loves it!
Fedora Kinoite or Silverblue as base. They are so stable, very nice to know they will not break. You may want universal blue.
GNOME has some form of parental control too but no idea.
GNOME is also stupid simple to use.
It may break KDE apps themes, and KDE has tons of nice learning apps. So I dont know about GNOME.
Education:
Educational Games:
Random harmless games
- Gameeky
- surge the rabbit or mari0
- Sidetrack
- Billiards
- SuperTuxKart, 0AD, and all the other classics
Easy tools for learning stuff
- Krita, Inkscape, GIMP
- Footage (very easy and minimalist), Pitivi, OpenShot or other video editors, depending on the difficulty (KDENlive, Flowblade and some more may be the best)
- Tenacity/Audacity for audio editing
- …
You probably want EndlessOS
Standard Ubuntu should have you covered.
One word of warning though, don’t be too egregious with the parental controls. If your kids are motivated enough, they will find a way around it.
Education really is your best weapon here. Tell them about the dangers of the modern web and computing.
Parents shouldn’t teach kids to use snaps
Someone had to say it 🤣🤣
If your kids are motivated enough, they will find a way around it.
Reminds me of my local public library in 1997. They had these public computers for people that didn’t yet have Internet access, and the browsers were locked down and stripped with just “back”, “forward”, “refresh” buttons and a URL address bar.
However, there was a tiny question mark icon in the corner that when clicked, brought up the Windows help system (that browser thing that can navigate help topics). There was a link in there to open IE and go to a support page, and when clicked would launch the full Internet Explorer with a complete menu over top of the kiosk interface, and this browser instance was not restricted in what it could access like the kiosk browser was (I believe it may have been a custom version of Mosaic).
Yep! Such container breakouts exist even today in Citrix !
Shit like this was what got me into cybersecurity
Basically any mainstream Linux distro is easy enough for a child, today.
For kids who can read tell them to press that ‘Windows’ key, and start typing what they’re looking for.
For younger kids, place appropriate icons on their desktop.
I do my parental controls at the network level (PiHole, etc), so I haven’t looked much into parental controls on the Linux host, itself.
I have started to favor PopOS, because it is familiar, because it looks a lot like SteamOs, what their SteamDeck runs, when they reboot into desktop mode, in order to mod their Minecraft.
Ummm, their SteamDeck runs Pop? Have you modded it? Because last I checked it ran SteamOS (an immutable Arch variant) and used KDE in desktop mode, whereas Pop uses Gnome…
I’m wrong. Good catch.
dont use parental controls. Its fake, doesnt make sense, and limits learn oportunities. Any Linux works out. Linux Mint works great
dont use parental controls
That’s how you get your kid to encounter MLP porn. Or worse, discover Gab and 4chan.
Early access in a controlled environment is a really good way to make sure people don’t fall down rabbit holes.
Obviously it depends how old, but if you block a specific website it’s only a matter of time before they work out a way around the block
Thats when you show them the picture of 4chan meetups and ask them if they want to end up like that.
And then you’d have to talk to them about it. Can you imagine the horror!
I know your intentions are good but if my kid stumbled across gore or animal abuse they’re going to require a level of “talking to” that is waaay beyond my skill level, and a content blocker is a lot cheaper than a child psychologist.
Who said I’d never talk to them about it? I’d just like to do it in a controlled manner at an appropriate age and prepare them without them seeing the most depraved shit right off the bat. Is that unreasonable?
Don’t assume the intentions of other people.
Custom DNS settings?
I use a combo of Pihole + OpenDNS with filters. And my kid’s user account does not have privileges to change network settings. Yet. Things will be enabled one by one in due time until he’s in 100% control of his own computer.
And if he actually knows what a DNS server is and is digging around for the setting, and trying to hack my shit, then I’d say he’s ready for the “adult” computing world.
Bypassing parental control is a great learning opportunity, tho :D
Probably have a porn and PC game filter to thank for my career in IT
Puppy?
As for the OS: any usable version of Linux will do. The thing about computers for kids is that they won’t learn anything if you don’t give them the real deal. Unless they’re 3 years old, I would stay away from the kiddie Linux distros. Chances are they won’t need to install much.
I was able to use a computer when I was 10 years old and that was full fat Windows XP. Taught myself Windows 98 and 2000 in English not long after. The generations before me were programming in a command prompt around that age, if their families could afford computers of course. The eighties proved that ten year olds can teach themselves assembly if they’re motivated, you don’t need to dumb things down for many kids.
Parental control is a problem, though, specifically the online stuff. Various distros offer various amounts of control but I don’t think anything comes close to what proprietary tools offer. Even proprietary tools can’t monitor Discord calls or detect suspicious Snapchat messaging, though.
Your best solution here may be to go full Windows 11+Microsoft everything; Microsoft’s parental controls work pretty well and they don’t require installing some shady third party tooling. In my personal experience, being able to work Windows will transfer pretty directly into being able to use Linux.
The best defence you may be able to mount, long-term, would be some network intelligence tooling to detect what kind of websites are being visited (DNS traffic ) and detect basic circumvention techniques (DoH, VPNs). I believe the most important part is that you don’t make a secret out of the fact the computer is monitored, that you gradually reduce restrictions over the years, and that your kids can come to you with any question or bad experience without fear of “punishment” in the form of stricter monitoring. Nothing creates distrust like finding out your parent is reading your messages or the idea that they will isolate you from your online friends when you’re found out.
What you could do, is configure an old, second computer that can’t go online with Linux and tell your kids to go ham. With some additional setup for snapshots and such (on either Windows or Linux), you can recover from almost any failure, so you can even give root access without too much risk.
Put some games onto it, let them mess around, under the understanding that only the more closely monitored Chromebook/computer/smartphone/tablet is allowed to go on the internet. That way, the kids can have a space of their own where they can explore computers in general risk-free, while you can guide them in the online stuff. This can be as simple as using an old desktop without a WiFi card that you occasionally plug an ethernet cable into for updates. You may need to work out some compatibility mess if you go with Linux, but if you use Steam you should be able to load decades of games onto that thing for cheap, more than enough to keep kids occupied I would say.
Being open and transparent about what you’re blocking and why is key. I fully agree. If your kids trust you, it makes it super easy for you to keep them safe.
