If you find yourself not wanting to switch, there are third party options for patching. I’m going to try zero patch, but I have no experience with them to date.
I mean, if whole EU countries can do it, so can you.
No, no its not. I get it lemmy has a hard on for Linux and libreoffice. But unfortunately its just not gonna happen windows is king. If you like or not its the main dog on the market and enterprises are not going to switch.
What the hell are you on about. This is not a “everyone or no one” thing. You can consider it. I have, I switched. I still use mac at work but I absolutely can switch at the homefront. Some companies use Linux, most use Windows. And they absolutely can consider switching.
I think at this point Android is the king of operating systems in terms of what the majority of consumer devices run. Perhaps the path forward is people plugging their phone into a dock and being presented with a more productive interface.
I’d actually argue enterprise is more likely for people to switch, there’s a lot of Linux sysadmins out there, and there’s a lot of Linux in enterprise environments, and of course especially servers.
Unless you have specific requirements for specific software that runs only on Windows, getting away from Microsoft can be a pretty tempting prospect. Even if there are people who fear change and the idea of change like the plague.
With a couple of governments making the switch I honestly think that things are changing to some degree. Will windows die and be forgotten by everyone overnight? Of course not. But I think there’s a real chance their piece of the pie will start to shrink noticeably. Chrome OS is dominating in schools for a few years now and Microsoft is seemingly trying hard to alienate the current windows users.
Microsoft already lost enterprise servers to Linux, and has lost significant ground over the years in consumer PCs to ChromeOS, MacOS, and Linux. Hell, the top PC gaming handheld is a Linux offering. That was an unheard of idea just a five years ago.
While I agree that business laptops will continue to be dominated by Windows for awhile, the market shifts we see everywhere have downstream effects on business laptops too. When you find yourself having to train more and more people on how to use Windows than you did in the past, the value argument for Windows on your employee’s laptops quickly comes into question.
I haven’t used Windows at work in years for anything, not for cloud hosting, not for on-prem, not for employee machines etc etc. until the cost-cutters came in and forced Teams and other Microsoft crap to squeeze the market during inflation. The company is just waiting to be killed off now.
OnlyOffice is way better than LibreOffice.
Installed Linux Mint a few months ago and have been dual booting. Hardly use Windows at all now.
Linux is exactly what an OS should be.
What is the highest spec pc I am likely to find for sale when people realise it cant go to windows 11?
Unless the requirements have changed, you’re looking at 2016-2017 era. Intel 7000-series, AMD Ryzen 1000-series. Newer may be available if there’s no TPM installed.
I had a look and it looks like you will not get anything special. The cutoff is around 2015. So for example Lenovo T440s will support Win11 but T440p will not. Looking at backmarket T440s is cheaper than T440p. So looks like you will only be able to get something ancient and the price will be pretty standard.
TMP 2.0 released in October 2014, so I don’t think that you can find particularly powerful systems up for grabs.
I’ve had windows update disabled for years so the fact that it’s “end of life” don’t mean shit to me. It’ll keep chugging along for years more.
That said, I installed Mint a week ago and love it!
Mint was my first Linux OS, and it’s been really nice.
Not my first, but the one I landed on after years. It’s just so good.
EOL means no more security updates, which means attack vectors don’t get patched.
If you keep using a Windows installation (or any OS for that matter) that isn’t patched regularly you are very likely to be victim to some malicious actor eventually. It’s not manual hacking anymore, it’s bots scraping the whole internet exploiting known vulnerabilities completely automated.
The risk is much lower if you’re in a home network with NAT, where your PCs IP is not publicly reachable, but if you communicate with any webservices you’re still vulnerable.
As example. If you nowadays put a Windows XP machine live on the internet with a public IP, it will be compromised within minutes.
So yeah. Good call switching to Mint, but please don’t use unpatched Windows.
Nat is not a security feature.
Just use ipv6
If you’re behind a conventional router they still do NAT afaik.
Per default your IPv6 address should be an internal one if it’s enabled.
I saw a YT video about XP being compromised. It was literally about 2-3 minutes, and it had been attacked.
Yeah, we managed to recreate that in a lab. Those old OS’s are super vulnerable.
I just rage-downgraded back to 10 a couple days ago. is there any reason why I shouldn’t just keep using it after this year? are we ever going to see a risk for zero day exploits for it like happened for XP after it depreciated?
Just look up windows related cves. There’s like 10 new exploits almost every month or so. Sure, not all of them will be super critical, but as time goes on they will stack up. I would not want to risk it, but you do you.
Consider running the LTSC version. It gets extended support.
ESU also offers one year of support for non-enterprise users for $30.
I’ve been migrating some of my clients (I do on site support for SMBs) to LTSC 2019, which gets updates until 2029. An added benefit is that it gets a lot less updates, essentially security updates, and comes with a lot less crap preinstalled.
If one were to run Win10 Enterprise LTSC IoT, “activated”… would it continue to automatically receive updates?
is there any reason why I shouldn’t just keep using it after this year?
You mean aside from all the reasons not to use Windows that applied even before deprecation? 'Cause there are a fuck-ton of those.
Unironically, yes. I was already aware of those and take them into account
The big thing to consider is what software do you really NEED, what can change, and what can you do without. Then the change is easier.
Then there’s the learning curve of new software. Wheee
For a lot of people that say of thinking doesn’t work, they explicitly don’t want to/wont go without, people enjoy luxury and convenience and aren’t going to skate by on only things they strictly need
It’s not all quite as rosy.
Yes, Linux is much more capable now than it was 10 years ago and it’s much more capable of being used as a main system. I myself have been using Linux as my main system for a few years now.
But it’s also a fact that a lot of stuff might not work (even if it works for someone else) and that some things are still more difficult than they should be.
For example, on my laptop cannot wake from sleep since kernel 6.11. I have manually sourced a 6.10 from an older version of my distro and keep holding it back, so that I can use my laptop as a laptop. For someone without technical skill, this would mean that their laptop just can’t sleep any more. Hibernate also doesn’t work.
Another example is that LibreOffice still makes a lot of formatting mistakes when it has to open word documents. And sure, everyone could just switch to odf, but it’s not quite as easy to make everyone else switch to odf. It makes it really hard to use LibreOffice in any kind of professional environment. Wouldn’t want to make a powerpoint presentation that then looks like shit when it’s played on a different PC.
Lastly, Nvidia sucks, but it’s also close to the only option for laptops with dGPUs. When I look for laptops with dGPUs available in my area on a price comparison platform, I find 760 laptops with Nvidia GPUs and only 3 with AMD, all of which are priced at least €500 more than comparable Nvidia devices. So if you want to go for a gaming laptop, Nvidia is pretty much the only option, and under Linux it really sucks. Steam games generally work ok for me, but trying to use Heroic Launcher to play anything from my gigantic library of free Epic/Amazon/GoG games, about 10% of the games I tried actually work. And even with those that work, my laptop sometimes just decides that a slide show with 3 FPS is good enough. That stays even after reboots and resets, and after a few days it returns to normal. Only to go back to slideshow mode a few days later.
If you just use your laptop to run a browser, I can recommend Linux 100%.
If you want to do anything else and don’t have any technical skills and/or don’t want to spend hours fixing things that should just work, I can’t fully recommend it.
I read posts just like yours ten years ago.
I guess you aren’t wrong. There are a lot of advances but stability and small but really annoying bugs remain a huge pain point.
I am a developer and Linux is my native environment in production systems. I wanted to use Linux on my laptop but sleeping / waking up never worked well enough. It could not switch from integrated video card to a discrete one ending up always using the discrete one which drained the battery in 30 minutes. All in all, it was usable but the details didn’t work so I gave up. That was years ago and eversince no customer really allows Linux…
Sleep/hibernate has been a pretty big problem for a while. As for the gpu, have you checked out NixOS? There’s ways to enforce your integrated card to handle everything and change states for certain apps to the discreet card.
It takes a bit to learn, but nixlang is pretty simple. I’ve heard it referred to as “JSON with functions”. It also has the largest package repository of any OS and is atomic, so its hard as hell to break. You can even make separate, containerized dev environments with flakes.
I’ve been a full time dev since 2012 and needed a Mac, I had barely used windows over that time but beforehand ran a PC service business.
Anyway, Ive been using Linux as a daily driver for the past 6 months for reasons.
… The other day I got a new cheap laptop I needed to setup for run a single application.
Holy fuck what a shitshow.
It took me 2 hours just to get to the desktop. Shit didn’t work, bullshit login screens, ads everywhere.
It was a massive pile of dog shit.
After battling to get the system setup for the rest of the day I gave up, chucked Fedora Kinoite On it… Took 30 minutes from creating boot media to getting a desktop going, chucked the app I needed to run in a Flatpack, chucked it on a USB, and it was up and running.
No bullshit.
Just works.
Truly the year of the Linux desktop.
I’m guessing the cheap laptop was running Windows? You didn’t mention, it sounds at first like you’re saying you were using Linux on it.
What ads were everywhere? Why did it “take 2 hours to get to the desktop” - you mean, that’s how long it took to install or something?
People here so full of shit. I just reimaged my lenovo t570 with windows 11 took less then 10mins to install. Another 5 to remove all the bs built in software like solitaire Cortana etc and then another 10-15 to apply all windows updates. Bam done.
Takes a lot more to fully deshittify it, though. I’ve been down that road. So much registry diving, so many third party apps, strongarming uninstallations of bloatware through brute force, and just all around weeks of work.
When the screenshot shit was announced the first time, I just got tired of looking for workarounds to disable or remove Microsoft’s active attempts of policing, spying, and triple-dip profiting off it’s paying customers.
Install the IoT version, that comes without any of the bloat and works just fine. Not even the Microsoft store is bundled in.
I have heard about the IoT version. I’d have to look more into it, but I doubt I’m going back now that I’ve learned so much about Linux. I can troubleshoot most of Arch without touching the docs or asking online now, so it really defeats the purpose of switching back.
I also enjoy putting in a little effort to get things working. That’s the thing about Linux. Most people that daily drive it get a dopamine release from tinkering with it and fixing things, and I’m one of those people.
I know there has been a big “its for everyone” push these days, but its really not. So I’m glad the IoT version exists for those that want or need it.
Yeah Linux is great, no doubt. I’ve been using Xubuntu since forever, never really touched Arch, but fundamentally if you know your way around one system, you’ll manage another.
Still, there are a bunch of applications that I must run under Windows, so it’s good to have the no frills version available for that.
Where does one purchase a single license for windows 10 iot lts? Isn’t that only for volume purchases by large enterprises?
Yeah, I’m not sure why anybody is mentioning Windows IoT. When you lookup where to buy this, Microsoft themselves tell you to call or email a salesman; it’s an enterprise-only thing. Recommending this for individuals is misguided.
You can even skip step 2 by using one of the IoT editions (either Win10 or Win11) which come minus the prepackaged bloatware.
Microsoft is mostly interested in making everything bullshit for home users. If you convince them you’re an enterprise customer, preferably by running up the old Jolly Roger, suddenly your life is a lot easier.
Yeah, sure. But I don’t run a shop anymore and just picked up an off the shelf machine from a retailer.
Turned it on, connected it to wifi, then it took forever to try and update itself, which failed, required another reboot, then made me sign in, which also failed, needed a reboot
I dont want a fucking ms account, I don’t want to wait for every update, just ask my name and take me to the desktop
Sounds like a personal skill issue. Especially if you bought some crappy off the shelf laptop.
Also you dont need any of that to use windows so again pushing false narrative since you can use windows with an offline account perfectly fine. Since I use mine for school and dont sign into Microsoft.
The only time I use Windows is for Fusion 360
I wish I could make parts in FreeCAD anywhere close to as good as I can in Fusion 360… I REALLY miss it since the move to Linux. I’m not anywhere near as excited about my 3D printer anymore since designing parts is a slog and the end result I am generally un-proud of. :( I feel like my only option (which sucks) is buy a second GPU for pass through and install windows 10 in a VM that only touches the internet once every 2 weeks to keep Fusion happy.
It’s possible to pass thru a single GPU. I followed this guide on my Fedora desktop
wishful thinking. i mean i get where the sentiment is coming from, but normal users are going to have a lot of problems if they make that switch. especially if they need particular types of software.
Call me when Libre doesn’t suck/feel like it’s stuck in 2003.
I won’t hold my breath.
Look like you’re already stuck in 2003
If you don’t like it, try OnlyOffice.
Call me when Windows doesn’t suck and it’s not getting worse year by year. I will laugh every time they add more ads and more tracking.
Baby duck syndrome.
