cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/22332949
JD Vance said that ‘American power comes with certain strings attached’
Block the lot.
We don’t need US far right propaganda.
We have our own.
Well NATO works both ways, and we’ve seen recently what happens if russia decides to walk into a non-NATO country.
If russia walks into the USA then NATO (probably renamed to the European Defence something) will be sitting back going “hey, sucks to be you. Shame you’re not in a mutual defence pact or something.”
I for one would welcome the shuttering of US miltary bases in Europe and around the world. Bring it on.
Saves us money too, which could be used for social welfare systems lol none of this will happen.
could be used for social welfare systems
For needy billionaires, maybe.
Oh that would go over well. Seems like they don’t understand what NATO actually is
These autocrats have always wanted to drop NATO.
Let’s not pretend like X is their reason. Supporting autocracy is their reason, and now they’re trying to come up with excuses to get the public onboard.
These autocrats have always wanted to drop NATO.
NATO is a terrorist organization led by USA. If any USA rulers want to disband it would be only to com up with a bigger and more evil organization.
I like how you say this and your instance is “sh. It just works”
what about it?
You wanting the same thing JD Vance wants should trigger a warning in your brain before you say anything else.
I said that NATO is a terrorist organization not that i want something
So, NATO had a problematic operation, trying to establish (and coordinate the establishment of) guerilla stay-behind troops to use in the event of Soviet takeover - and the operation went especially problematic in Italy during the Years of Lead, where some of those guys associated with right-wing terrorists. The year was 1969 or so.
Basing on this, how do I conclude anything about the NATO of today?
Disclaimer: I was asked to hold an anti NATO speech during a protest event during a NATO summit. Being a moderately honest anarchist, I held a speech denouncing the practises seen in Afghanistan (the year was 2012), but emphasized that collective self defense is a valuable thing to have (a common attitude here in Eastern Europe), and added that if the alliance would bother doing what it says on the sticker, I would support it.
NATO is an alliance of various countries. Some of them aren’t nice or democratic (classic example: Turkey). Mixed bag, and constantly changing. Membership in NATO is not a letter of indulgence for a member state to do anything - allies are obliged to help only if someone attacks a member state. If a NATO member attacks someone else, allies can ignore the affair or even oppose the member (example: Turkey recently bombed Kurdish troops in Syria so sloppily that threatened US troops shot down a Turkish drone).
“According to several Western European researchers, the operation involved the use of assassination, psychological warfare, and false flag operations to delegitimize left-wing parties in Western European countries, and even went so far as to support anti-communist militias and right-wing terrorism as they tortured communists and assassinated them, such as Eduardo Mondlane in 1969”
Based on this conclude what you want about the NATO of today.
Yeah dude! Tell them! Also tell them what was the normal operations at the time! And what are Russia and China doing today!!!
Based on this, I conclude: the NATO of today is a mostly defensive alliance with some taints in its history.
It is currently very busy doing a real job - opposing a conquering dictator named Vladimir Putin.
I wish it luck, as long as it sticks to its declared purpose. If it oversteps, I will revise my opinion.
Your opinions are certainly grounded in reality at least. It’s refreshing to read something sensible for a change.
taints in its history
Ooh, let’s play “find the dark history”! What better way to distract from today’s issues and avoid talking about solutions for tomorrow’s problem!
This is me agreeing with you, to be clear. The description “taints in its history” is so ubiquitous as to be useless. Yes, acknowledging the errors of the past is important to learn from them and improve, but the focus needs to be on that learning and improving.
The NATO has potential to be a force of security. In a modern world, conflict between peers is more destructive than ever and the returns on aggressive action are more strongly affected by the strength of the defense, such a union of forces can discourage attack by making it too unprofitable.
Of course, that requires the union to actually stand united and the potential aggressor to be reasonable and motivated by the state’s prosperity. Neither of those seem entirely guaranteed right now…
It is currently very busy doing a real job
Yes i’m sure they are doing a very busy job like they were in their tainted history (false flag operations to delegitimize left-wing parties in Western European countries)
If it oversteps
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_Response
“Several of the operations were along the coast in the borders between sea and land, and together with roads and populated areas. Surveillance, patrols, road control posts, vehicle inspection, control of air space, minesweeping, evacuation of civilians, and riot control were important part of the exercise.”
If you are sure about something, then bring evidence of considerable off-label activities.
In response to your response about “Nordic Response”:
Surveillance, patrols, road control posts, vehicle inspection, control of air space, minesweeping, evacuation of civilians, and riot control were important part of the exercise.”
Those are realistic military duties in war time. Every military practises them. Where do you find a fault?
An example from real life: the Ukrainian military has checkpoints on roads near the frontline. Moving with a vehicle, you’d expect to show papers, say a few words and maybe even show transported goods. The purpose? Finding reconnaisance / sabotage groups, which every competent enemy is expected to send. If an opponent doesn’t send recon or saboteurs, they are fools. If a military doesn’t learn how to deter those, they’re fools.
How does one learn? After dry reading in a classroom: one holds an excercise. There’s a home team and an opposing team. The home team checks, the opposing team infiltrates. Both teams report what they achieved, results get compared. If the blue team found the “saboteurs”, good. If the red team “blew up” all bridges and pipelines in the area, people think hard about what they did wrong. If they don’t practise, they don’t get to think hard.
Those are realistic military duties in war time. Every military practises them. Where do you find a fault?
Where do i find a fault in conducting vehicle inspections and riot control at peace time, from an organization with a shady past involving false flag operations, psychological warfare and assassinations aimed at delegitimize left-wing parties.
Dunno buddy let me keep thinking
An example from real life: the Ukrainian military has checkpoints on roads near the frontline. Moving with a vehicle, you’d expect to show papers, say a few words and maybe even show transported goods. The purpose? Finding reconnaisance / sabotage groups, which every competent enemy is expected to send. If an opponent doesn’t send recon or saboteurs, they are fools. If a military doesn’t learn how to deter those, they’re fools.
The ukrainian military also have checkpoints in the west border to make sure any male between 18 and 60 doesn’t leave the country so that they can be forced into war.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobilization_in_Ukraine
How does one learn? After dry reading in a classroom: one holds an excercise. There’s a home team and an opposing team. The home team checks, the opposing team infiltrates. Both teams report what they achieved, results get compared. If the blue team found the “saboteurs”, good. If the red team “blew up” all bridges and pipelines in the area, people think hard about what they did wrong. If they don’t practise, they don’t get to think hard.
To me this sound like military rhetoric coming from a military man. You self defined yourself as being a moderately honest anarchist, i suggest you to keep doing your anarchist readings and re-read the works of Emma Goldman and Errico Malatesta.
https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/emma-goldman-preparedness-the-road-to-universal-slaughter
As if the US and a whole lot other countries are not doing Psy-Ops and other behind the scenes actions. pulling strings on the world stage.
Yes, but they need to repay the rat elon for all his support during the campaign. This might even be true
This is a key part of fascism, government and industry being one and the same entity.
What a time to be alive.
Not for long, if RFK Jr has his way.
If ur mean to Elon we leave NATO.
A very hinged take. Thank you Kanye, very cool.
The only way to deal with them is to call them on every bluff so that making a bluff becomes a liability’
What a coincidence that Elon Musk paid 100+ million for their campaign
God I hate Earth.
Earth is lovely, it’s humanity I struggle with.
Humanity is lovely, it’s politicians I struggle with.
The orange dickhead is not yet at his new place, but the asshole followers are already raging :(
Old article, btw. This is from Sept 2024. I get that’s what he promised, and while I think he’s a complete asshat, let’s not discount that he and Trump said and will say anything to appear smart, capable, and as if they have a plan.
Time will tell if this actually comes to pass, but I’m not actually going to hold my breath for this one.
Good note, I didn’t notice that in the original post. I edited the title
Disgusting regime whore don’t wait to get into the
whitewhore house before he starts earning its fee.I hope musk donkey bunches it after their nest tryst…
Don’t threaten them with good times
Suck our misinformaphalus and don’t apply your own laws or we will abandon you.
Sounds like fascist talk, yeah.
