Hey all. Getting right to it:

Last November, a majority of my wife’s family voted trump. I immediately made known my disgust and that I had no interest in maintaining relationships with any of them. My wife is equally appalled, but family is important to her and she chooses to compartmentalise it for the sake of their relationships. That’s her call. Typically, her mother comes to stay at our house for an extended period as we live far away, and this year I tolerated her being here for the sake of my wife.

But now, thinking about the next visit and how bad things have gotten, I can’t even stand the thought of having her in my house, let alone being in the same room as her. I really don’t want her here at all, but I will again tolerate her for my wife’s sake. However I think it’s likely that I will make myself pretty scarce during that time.

So the ethics question is - given that I expressed my distaste after the election but still remained cordial, is it ok, ethically speaking, to become more resentful as the consequences of their actions become more apparent? Or, given that what has happened since is pretty much out of everyone’s hands, am I locked in to the level of hostility I showed immediately after?

I guess the distilled version is - a person does X, I express disapproval. Is it ethical to express MORE disapproval as additional unforeseen consequences of X become apparent?

Thanks for your thoughts!

Edit to Clarify - My mother in law is not MAGA and I don’t think she’s enjoying any of it. She thinks we can “just not talk about it” and everything will be fine. However she has become more racist and judgemental (anti-trans etc) in recent years. Hates Joe Biden and Kamal Harris but can’t or won’t say why. Thanks for the responses so far and I’ll try to respond, but I’m about to start work shortly.

  • JTskulk@lemmy.world
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    2 days ago

    Divorce your wife, hit the gym, get a tan, do laundry. Please use a better post title next time.

  • artifactsofchina@lemmy.world
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    2 days ago

    Not in America so viewing you as on the front lines of this present catastrophe.

    Please do everything you can to avoid further entrenching resentment.

    It looks like your country is so bitterly divided. I’ve visited once, and my impression was then that there is a lot more grey than any media or the internet conveys.

    If you’re living close to someone who supported that maniac, please do what you can to build bridges so that they can find a way back to sanity. I get that it’s not fair and that responsibility should fall on them. But realistically I think you need to be the adult in the relationship.

    Please do what you can to build bridges and be compassionate, curious. Own your own sense of moral outrage and dignity, but give these people space to make their mistakes and learn from them, without your judgement. Direct your hatred and anger against the acts that upset you, but be gracious and kind in your relationships. Allow your mother in law to be wrong. Honour whatever is good in her.

    Don’t be a player hater!

    If she says something racist, don’t just let it stand. But where you can, see if you can draw out her reasons. See if you can uncover the true fears behind the scapegoating. Just let her be heard, without judgement. Be curious about the person. And where you can do so with humility, share your own beliefs and what is important to you. But share in the interests of being known, not of flag bearing.

    Give yourself space where you need. It’s OK to feel strongly, and to be upset. But please, do the work to build bridges, don’t let your family be divided by an utter madman.

  • JackbyDev@programming.dev
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    3 days ago

    I think any response (short of something like physical assault) is probably ethical. Think about your mental health and your wife’s opinion on it too.

    I hate my in-laws for similar reasons. (My wife dislikes them too.) We all have a very spoken no politics rule when we visit. This makes family gatherings more tolerable. We only see them maybe 4 or 5 times a year. We’ve definitely seen them less as things got worse politically. Last year we even skipped Thanksgiving with them.

  • HurricaneLiz@lemmy.world
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    3 days ago

    You can forgive her and feel compassion for her for being misled and confused, but not allow speech that violates your own ethics in your own home. Bonus - no more resentment on your end, which is healthier for you, personally, regardless of what she chooses to do with her own life.

    • czardestructo@lemmy.world
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      2 days ago

      This is exactly how I conduct myself with my maga mother in law. Any bigoted shit in front of my daughter gets publicly squashed and any political topics are quickly dealt with and put in its place. She lives a life of ignorance, dont be mad, feel bad.

  • IIII@lemmy.world
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    3 days ago

    Disclaimer: I’m not American so will never understand your culture towards politics as well.

    I don’t think it’s fair to point at every bad thing Trump has done so far and say that’s the fault of your MIL for voting for Trump. The way I see it as a non-American, Trump did say he was going to be a racist xenophobic piece of shit on his election campaign, but the media heavily downplayed this, and Trump still tricked and lied to everyone. Politics is weird like that: you can theoretically campaign on one thing but then throw everything out and do the opposite once you get elected.

    Hating Kamala and Biden is a fair opinion to hold as well. I consider a vote for them as picking the lesser of the 2 evils, rather than voting on what’s best for America, because both parties seemed awful to me (a non-American).

    I think it’s important that you try to at least understand and empathise with why your MIL voted Trump in the first place. You were very light on those details in your post, which I suspect is because you’re very quick to judge someone based on who they vote for.

    Maybe she really hated one policy from the democrats so voted for Trump? Maybe she bought all the lies Trump told during his campaign and regrets her vote strongly? Maybe she’s a single-issue person who voted for Trump because of one policy and ignored everything else?

    • edible_funk@lemmy.world
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      3 days ago

      I don’t really appreciate the way this comment equivocates the openly racist adjudicated rapist accused pedophile Trump with Biden and Harris.

  • BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today
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    3 days ago

    If your MiL voted for Trump, then she’s a filthy MAGA, stop making excuses for her. Live your normal life, yell at the news, complain loudly every time you hear another one of his inane statements, criticize loudly and often.

    That’s what it’s like in a normal, patriotic American household. Make her live like a real American, and not in her imaginary alternative MAGA reality, and stop coddling her treason. Tell her you won’t tolerate talk of treason, racism, etc. Call her out EVERY time, and tell her it’s unacceptable in your house, and in YOUR America. You can say ANTHING YOU WANT, but she has to keep her treason to herself. Period, no negotiation. Freedom of Treasonous Speech does not have to exist in your house.

    If she doesn’t like it, she can GTFO. We should no longer tolerate any MAGA bullshitp. It’s time to push back HARD, and don’t stop.

  • bridgeenjoyer@sh.itjust.works
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    3 days ago

    Happening to my in laws as well. I warned SO this would happen and we need to be very careful or they’ll be full maga like my parents. The fox news propaganda machine has immense power.

  • RBWells@lemmy.world
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    3 days ago

    With my ex MIL I stay friendly because she’s great in so many ways, and just act completely ignorant when she says something awful, for example:

    ExMIL: I’m looking for a church but can’t find one that is Christian enough.

    Me: Oh, I understand. So many are just so worldly now and not at all Christ like, they don’t welcome the stranger, they do that prosperity gospel nonsense, culture war bullshit instead of good works. That makes sense.

    ExMIL: oh I meant they are too progressive, too loosey goosey (Paraphrasing)

    Me: Huh?

    Or

    ExMIL: I don’t understand this trans nonsense.

    Me: I know, right? Who gives a fuck what someone else says they are! You say you are a boy, you are a boy, it doesn’t have any effect on anyone else, I don’t understand the drama around it, at all.

    Basically whenever I get a chance I just intentionally misinterpret it like there is no possibility that she meant that, because nobody could possibly mean that.

    • edible_funk@lemmy.world
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      3 days ago

      I’ve tried this. It usually ends up with them thinking you’re kinda dumb, which is ironic. But they almost never get the point and make the connection either way.

  • LambeauLeap@sopuli.xyz
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    3 days ago

    Dude please please please don’t let Trump ruin your marriage. Not allowing your MIL to stay for her annual visit when your wife wants her to is gonna be a big big problem

    • BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today
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      3 days ago

      It’s not ruining your marriage to insist that treason, racism, intolerance, pedophilia, etc. isn’t acceptable in your home. If your wife chooses that over her marriage, then you are better off. She can live with her MAGA mother for the rest of her life.

  • Nibodhika@lemmy.world
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    4 days ago

    I don’t think this is an ethics question, you’re asking whether resentment builds or fades over time and the answer will be very specific to each person and case. That being said there’s one thing I would like to point out:

    a person does X, I express disapproval. Is it ethical to express MORE disapproval as additional unforeseen consequences of X become apparent?

    Those weren’t unforseen, that’s the worst part for me, they were clearly foreseen, foretold and warned about, and I could potentially be persuaded to believe people were unaware of that the first time around, but by the second time you are obviously okay with all of it.

    • TheCriticalMember@aussie.zoneOP
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      4 days ago

      I’m being a little generous with that. I agree that they knew he was a piece of shit, but I think a lot of them thought he’d just hurt the people they look down on and not them.

  • mvirts@lemmy.world
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    4 days ago

    Resentment is usually a feeling which has little to do with ethics.

    Actions are more easily analyzed for ethical value.

    I guess that you’re considering the action of showing resentment by being absent or cold to them.

    From a utilitarian perspective this could serve the purpose of communicating your resentment indirectly which may increase the overall good by preventing this scizsm from infiltrating other parts of your life and others. On the other hand this outcome is not guaranteed.

    If you apply value ethics of your actions it really depends on what ideals you hold yourself to.

    If you take a completely honest person as your ideal, direct communication is probably more ethical than indirect communication, but indirect communication would still be superior to deceiving them into thinking you agree with them in any way.

    Instead, you may idealize an honest pacifist who would value indirect communication higher than direct if direct would also come with conflict.

    These are my thoughts, I am by no means an expert in ethics.

    • TheCriticalMember@aussie.zoneOP
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      4 days ago

      you may idealize an honest pacifist who would value indirect communication higher than direct if direct would also come with conflict

      This is the approach I’m going with, though I’d classify it more as isolation than indirect communication. Earlier this year I told the mother in law that her proud maga children are no longer welcome in my home and that turned into a bad night for everyone. After that night I decided I’d just keep myself away from her as much as possible.

      • magnetosphere@fedia.io
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        3 days ago

        I’m glad you took a stand. Surgery is “bad”, but it’s a lot better than just pretending the problem doesn’t exist.

  • doctordevice@lemmy.ca
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    4 days ago

    I promise I’m not trying to be dismissive, but do you think you might be autistic? I ask because I am and I struggle with very rigid thinking on how I should react to the consequences of people’s actions that I believe were blatantly foreseeable.

    I struggle with this very same issue in my own family. I’ve already gone no contact with my older sister who went full Qanon during COVID, and I barely have a relationship with my Trump-loving grandparents anymore. That relationship is a little laden with religious trauma too, so might not be totally comparable to your situation (I still have to vaguely pretend to be Christian around them even though I’ve been staunchly atheist for twenty years).

      • doctordevice@lemmy.ca
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        4 days ago

        This is the most damning evidence of all! When you become more aware of how your autism affects your perception, it’s easier to spot in others.

        I have really high justice sensitivity, and your description of your perception changing as injustices were borne out from their actions feels a lot like how I would react. I don’t think you’re wrong at all, but I don’t think your wife is either. It’s a very hard situation. I don’t regret cutting or limiting contact with my far right family, but I would have a hard time doing that with my wife’s family for the same reasons you’ve laid out.

        • TheCriticalMember@aussie.zoneOP
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          4 days ago

          I’m definitely not pushing my wife in any direction, just listening and supporting. I have a hard time sympathizing with her attachment to family as mine were abusive assholes and I cut ties with them years ago. I’ll never suggest she do the same, but it wouldn’t bother me at all if she does. I learned a long time ago not to rely on anyone else.

  • AmericanEconomicThinkTank@lemmy.world
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    4 days ago

    Sorta. Anger and resentment tends to fester continually so ensuring you make your grievances known one way or another can help. If you do want to make it known, but cannot have a healthy dialogue, I personally recommend you write it out, and once you have it dialed in you can send it or hand it to them if you wish.

    Personally though, I’d def say that making sure your sweetheart of a wife knows how your feelings have been and continue to move is just as if not more important. Has she mentioned the how and why she managed to tolerate politics given everything?

    • TheCriticalMember@aussie.zoneOP
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      4 days ago

      She feels much the same as I do, and I know she struggles with it a lot. For me, the moment I found out, they all got moved into the category of trump supporters, who I have no time for. But for her, it’s obviously a much bigger deal. I don’t press her on how she should handle it, just support the way she chooses to.

  • FuglyDuck@lemmy.world
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    4 days ago

    To your edit… it rather sounds like she is in fact MAGA and doesn’t want to admit to the “why”. there’s really not very many people who were both willing to vote for trump a second time and aren’t MAGA, even if they don’t want to admit it.

    from an ethics stand point, I’ll remind you of an old german saying. “If 10 men are sitting at a table with a nazi, you have 11 nazis.” You cannot look at trump and honestly conclude he’s an acceptable (never mind good,) president without also agreeing with his fascist and tyrannical bullshit. if she’s genuinely unhappy with the status quo, she can show it by protesting or something. Until then, she’s still a trump supporter and still part of the problem, and there is zero excuse for not knowing what he was about. he said he was going to do everything that he’s doing. (well. maybe not the ballroom or shitting himself, but details.)

    but none of us are the ones you need to be having this conversation with. we can’t decide what’s right here… that’s a personal decision you need to make with your wife.

    • TheCriticalMember@aussie.zoneOP
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      4 days ago

      Pretty much hit the nail on the head there boss. No matter how hard I try I can’t accept the ignorance excuse after what all of us have seen. Earlier this year I said to my mother in law “surely you knew at the time that you were doing the wrong thing?” She denied it. The best approach for me is to be around the MIL as little as possible. My wife knows that. It makes her sad, but she understands.