I’ve watched the keynote and read some stuff on the internet and I’ve found this video about a dude talking about the new update (I linked it here because if you didn’t see the keynote, this is probably enough)
Is it just me, or… does no one address that Apple does a Microsoft move by basically scanning everything on every machine and feeding this into their LLM?
- usually people got Microsoft license for free (by working in company, and company buy you enterprise license)
- But with apple, people usually get it by passion.
Maybe you’re making an apples to oranges comparison. But anyway, nobody I know thinks Apple has good intentions with regard to their data.
If you watch WWDC, they shared how it works. They have a private cloud that does not persist data on it, only processes it. Also, it’s audited by a third party and there is a cryptographic mechanism that will not allow your request to be accepted unless the server software has been publicly signed by the auditor. At least, this is my best understanding of it from what I remember.
Also, in the same presentation they announced that you can now lock your Apps and hide them, which will keep its data out of the OS search results. I am fairly certain this also means it’s opted out of ML/AI processing given that any LLM would rely on the same search index.
It’s really simple: Microsoft is a business solutions company. Microsoft helps your boss spy on you at work. Your boss is their customer, not you.
Apple is a consumer products company. You are their customer. They market their products on privacy and security. Betraying that marketing message by spying on users is shooting themselves in the foot, so they’re incentivized not to do that.
Neither company is trustworthy. Economic incentives are the trustworthy concept here. Barring screwups, we can trust both companies to do what is profitable to them. Microsoft profits by spying on users, Apple does not (not right now anyway).
they definitely do spy on their users and sell their data, but are very clever at marketing their items as fashionable and people fall for it
Do you have a source for this?
Specifically about personal data…
Apple may engage third parties to act as our service providers and perform certain tasks on our behalf, such as processing or storing data, including personal data, in connection with your use of our services and delivering products to customers.
As for anonymized aggregate data…
Aggregated data is considered non‑personal data for the purposes of this Privacy Policy.
(All from Apple’s privacy page)
So they may not be explicitly selling identifiable information (which is usually pretty standard with big companies, I think), they are sharing it with other companies (which is normal)…and they’re also almost definitely selling anonymized data (which is also standard).
LMAO at thinking Apple doesn’t spy on you
Exactly.
My employer runs macos. So I’d argue Mac is still a business solution, but not as common as windows. Tools exist for managing macs at scale as well.
I think it all remains to be seen, Apple was very specific in their wording about privacy, probably BECAUSE they saw what happened to Microsoft. We didn’t see any live demos and I am still a bit skeptical that it will work that well.
A key difference in how Apple is doing it though, is that it only exposes necessary data as context to an LLM request. Whereas Microsoft was capturing and training on everything.
I don’t have an iPhone 14 so luckily I can’t test this day one, I will wait for reviews and security researchers to look it over.
I think Apple’s emphasis on the privacy and security stuff would have happened anyway, because they’ve been positioning themselves as privacy focused for several years now.
Not true. I hate them both for this and a litany of other reasons. Holding back humanity’s development and being the chief cause of e-waste are at the top of the pile.
Mainly because Apple explained how it works and Microsoft just said we’re going to record everything you do
I’m going to copy paste a reply I left somewhere else. This was for iOS AI, I’m unsure what the implemention for macOS is. If they are scanning everything then I do not support it.
From what I saw,
MS Recall is a 24/7 AI monitor system that captures everything you look at and saves it for later. They didn’t even do the bare minimum for protecting the data, it was just dumped in an unencytped folder where anyone get wholesale access to the data. All trust has been lost.
Apple is using AI as a tool to improve specific tasks/features that a user invokes. Things like assistant queries and the new calculator. They have said some promising things in regards to privacy, specificly with the use of ChatGPT - any inquiry sent to ChatGPT will ask the user permission first and obscure their IP. This shows they care enough to try, they have not lost our trust - but we remain skeptical.
If apple tries the same thing by scanning everything wholesale, then that’s getting over shadowed by the promises made by the implentaion on the much more popular iOS.
OP will never acknowledge this.
Apple has always had a better PR team.
As far as I know, Apple’s implementation of LLMs is completely opt-in
And local. Probably. Maybe. Perchance.
It’s both local and remote, according to their page. There are some activities that run on a “private cloud”. I’d imagine that image creation is one of those
While this is true, is it fact?
That we’ll probably only know after someone tries to test all the features without an active internet connection
It’s all local, except when it isn’t.
Apple also has a MUCH better track record relating to user privacy over pretty much every other big tech company.
Falsehoods continue to make their way from Reddit to Lemmy…
https://www.yahoo.com/news/former-apple-engineer-says-button-164452709.html
This entire article is a nothingburger from 3 years ago. You’re telling me that the button saying “ask app not to track” still makes it possible for the app to track you? Almost like there’s a difference between the words “ask” and “enforce”? Did you read the article you sent? How is that even in the same universe as installing a keylogger into every Copilot PC by default?
I never claimed Apple is perfect at privacy, I said they are better than the competition.
This entire article is a nothingburger
It may be the case that your blind beliefs in Apple are a nothingburger, and that nobody should believe iSheeps when they say Apple is trustworthy in any capacity.
People really don’t want to believe that Apple, Microsoft and Google are all not on their side, so they choose to believe Apple is good, as some kind of a lesser evil.
I have seen it for so long, I am convinced helping western privacy community is a hopeless endeavour. At some point I might quit. I created privatelife community and plethora of guides, but I think I was an idiot to do it.
I didn’t know that was a controversial opinion? Do you think that Apple are as bad as Google or Meta in terms of privacy?
Apple does have privacy violations, but the things I’ve seen them get caught doing are minor compared to the things that many other companies do openly.
The main point of the article you’ve linked is that Apple put the equivalent of a “Do not track” option in a browser, and it did exactly the same of a “Do not track” option in a browser (nothing). Does that mean that any browser with a DNT request option is bad for privacy?
Adding an option that is somewhat misleading isn’t ideal, but it’s incomparable to something like Cambridge analytica incident, or the tracking that Google put basically everywhere on the Internet.
By the way, I am in no way defending Apple. I’m just saying that everything that Apple does, companies like Google and Meta also do, just ten times over.
I believe an iPhone is way better than a Pixel for privacy, even if both are far from ideal. I’d love to be proven wrong, tho.
Apple markets whatever it does in a grandiose manner, and pretends that since it does things late, it polishes everything, everything Just Werks™ and Apple makes no faults. Their PR washing machine also ensures their blunders also look like an oops cute moment.
I will refer you to the “Why not Apple devices?” section in my guide. https://lemmy.ml/post/128667 You will find tons of details on why Apple devices are horrible. Moreover, Android fully surpassed iOS in terms of security around Android 8 or 9, about 6 years ago. It is far costlier to buy or find a 0day for Android since many years now, which also happens to be the basis for million dollar costs of Israeli Cellebrite kits and Israeli Pegasus malware.
On the contrary, Apple’s track record for collecting data is deliberately obtuse and utilizes dark patterns to make it as difficult as possible to not upload your info to them.
From the article,
the user is given the option to enable Siri, but “enabling” only refers to whether you use Siri’s voice control. “Siri collects data in the background from other apps you use, regardless of your choice, unless you understand how to go into the settings and specifically change that,”…“In practice, protecting privacy on an Apple device requires persistent and expert clicking on each app individually"…the steps required are “scattered in different places.”
Apple devices might be arguably more secure than other vendors, but security and privacy are not the same thing.
Apple cult sheeps
I saw a comment somewhere that said: “people have been burnt by Microsoft too many times, while Apple still has a benefit of the doubt for many people in regards to privacy”. People still have some trust in Apple, compared to MS.
Edit: Found the comment by @deweydecibel@lemmy.world
If Apple announced Recall? Apple wouldn’t announce Recall, that’s the whole point. Apple wouldn’t be so brazen and stupid to push a tool that is so obviously invasive and so poorly implemented. Apple earned its trust by not making those mistakes.
But if they did decide to say fuck it and implement something like Recall, of course people would trust them. That’s what trust means: consumers take them at their word. But if it’s as bad as Microsoft’s Recall, Apple would burn all that trust when people found out.
People don’t believe Microsoft because they have long since burned any trust and good will for most of their consumers. They have proven time and time again they don’t give a shit about users’ wants or needs, and users have felt that. So when they announce Recall, they have no earned trust. No believes them. There’s no good faith to cushion this. And it turns out everyone was right not to grant them that trust.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://piped.video/watch?v=B_SqrNMPV5c&pp=ygUMTWFjIG9zIHNwaWVz
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
Opt-in ; Respecting Agency; Explicit Consent.
Microsoft has every intention of SHOVING this down your throat, and only corporate group policy will be exempted. They will use every nag screen, dark pattern, accidently enabling with updates, randomized installs, to make it happen. Look at what they do with edge, for an example. MS absolutely does not respect consent. #MS-MeToo
Apple for all its faults, respects people when they say No, and if they say it’s opt-in, they have a track record to back that up. Apple says ‘Hey look at this cool new feature you can use’, and I think Horray - more choice.
Skimming all the comments, didn’t see this mentioned explicitly
Linux
Spam.
Linux what?
Ah, Linux.
Linux. Linux. Linux. Linux. Linux. Linux. Linux. Linux. Linux. Linux. Linux. Linux. Linux. Linux. Linux.
GNU. GNU. GNU. GNU. GNU. GNU. GNU. GNU. GNU. GNU. GNU. GNU. GNU. GNU. GNU. GNU. GNU. GNU.
