Hi all, the private school I work at has a tonne of old windows 7/8 era desktops in a student library. The place really needs upgrades but they never seem to prioritise replacing these machines. Ive installed Linux on some older laptops of mine and was wondering if you all think it would be worth throwing a light Linux distro on the machines and making them somewhat usable for a web browsing experience for students? They’re useless as is, running ancient windows OS’s. We’re talking pre-7th gen i5’s and in some cases pentium machines here.

Might be pointless but wonder what you guys think?

  • digdilem@lemmy.ml
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    5 months ago

    Instead of you installing linux on them, why not make it a project for the kids? Give them a bunch of distros to try and see what they learn.

      • EarthShipTechIntern@lemm.ee
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        5 months ago

        Wholeheartedly agree!

        To really learn computers, let them dig into all the guts (hardware & software). Of course letting them choose & install their top pick OS sounds like a great way to start.

        Good luck!

  • Possibly linux@lemmy.zip
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    5 months ago

    You also can upgrade them to Win10. Make sure you have a AD domain along with monitoring and blocking as required in your area.

    You should not connect machines running Win7 or 8 to the internet.

  • azvasKvklenko@sh.itjust.works
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    5 months ago

    Just throw a USB stick on them and boot something like Linux Mint (defaults are pretty similar to Windows, should be obvious to anyone how to use it) to see how it runs with no installation and maybe showcase that to someone who could decide explaining briefly what it is and how it’s more lightweight.

    I assume these have still some mechanical drives and that will probably be their biggest slow down. Upgrading to SSDs (which is still a lot cheaper than full computers) would bring them second life.

    The i5’s have plenty of power for web browsing machines and can still be pretty snappy. Pentiums (4’s?) not so much, but it’s also worth trying

  • nyan@sh.itjust.works
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    5 months ago

    They’re unlikely to do worse than my laptop from 2008, and it’s perfectly usable under Linux (bit of a lag when starting up large programs, that’s all). As has already been said, go for a lighter desktop environment (XFCE, LXQT, Mate, TDE) unless these machines were high-spec’d for their era. For the oldest machines, you might want to consider installing Puppy Linux rather than one of the more mainstream distributions, since Puppy specializes in old x86-family hardware.

  • bloodfart@lemmy.ml
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    5 months ago

    Yes of course it’ll work fine.

    I use a third gen i5 laptop as a daily driver and run mid-poly count cad and cam, host windows vms and do everything else but play games that people expect out of a computer (no time for games nowadays).

    Look into installing more ram and ssds in the old desktops and they’ll skip along happily for another decade or until mainline kernels drop support for their instruction set. I’m running Debian and rhel (seriously look into this, they have programs to get cheap licenses into the hands of educational institutions and provide good support) but probably anything is fine, just figure out account security so kids don’t go around copy and pasting whatever stack exchanges llm suggests into bash.

    E: I read the rest of the thread and there’s a lot of “this worked for my computers/this worked for me” advice. Not hating, I literally gave that exact advice myself.

    Call red hat sales if you’re in the us, I guess suse sales if you’re in europe or india. They’ll most likely set you up with a pilot program license and if not they’ll walk you through the process of creating one or two accounts to work around the “ten free machines but then you gotta pay” limitation.

    You’ll be able to sell it to administration as “this program gets students in the drivers seat of the systems used for stem research, ai and android development for minimal upgrade cost and no new units. Developing familiarity with these systems will give students who pursue those studies a tangible advantage over their peers.”

    If you have coworkers in computer education or it, sell it to them as a path to get more certs at a reduced or nonexistent cost (red hat and suse have their own cert programs that they use for training like ms and cisco do).

    Good luck!

  • Romkslrqusz@lemm.ee
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    5 months ago

    useless

    pre-7th gen i5’s

    I’ve got systems with second and third gen i5s that are handling Windows 10 just fine, seems like what the school really needs is some SSDs.

    Linux would definitely run better, so that’s worth it too.

    If this school is heavily embedded im the Google ecosystem, ChromeOS Flex is an option. FydeOS is similar but without the Google Account requirement.

  • Veraxis@lemmy.world
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    5 months ago

    That covers a pretty wide range of hardware, but that era would be around 2009-2015, give or take, so you would be looking at around Intel 1st gen to 6th gen most likely (Let’s be honest, there is nearly zero chance institutions would be using anything but Intel in that era). Pentium-branded CPUs from that time range, unfortunately, likely means low-end dual core CPUs with no hyperthreading, so 2C/2T, but I have run Linux on Core2-era machines without issue, so hopefully the CPU specs will be okay.

    2-8GB of DDR3 RAM is most likely for that era, and as others point out, will be your biggest issue for running browsers. If the RAM is anything like the CPUs, I am assuming you will be looking at the lower end with 2-4GB depending on how old the oldest machines you have are, so I second the recommendation of maybe consolidating the RAM into fewer machines, or if you can get any kind of budget at all, DDR3 sticks on ebay are going to be dirt cheap. A quick look and I see bulk listings of 20x4GB sticks for $26.

    In terms of DE, I second anything with XFCE, but if you could bump them up to around 8GB RAM, then I think any DE would be feasible.

    Hard drives shouldn’t be an issue I think, since desktop hard drives in the 320GB-1TB range would have been standard by then. Also, you are most likely outside of the “capacitor plague” era, so I would not expect motherboard issues, but you might open them up and dust them out so the fans aren’t struggling. Re-pasting the CPUs would also probably not be a bad idea, so maybe consider adding a couple $5 tubes of thermal paste to a possible budget. Polysynthetic thermal compounds which do not dry out easily would be preferable, and something like Arctic Silver 5 would also be an era-appropriate choice, lol.

    • michael_palmer@lemmy.sdf.org
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      5 months ago

      I’m running Gnome 46 on i3 3217U with 4GB RAM. Works so smooth, maybe even better than Cinnamon. SSD makes all the difference.

    • puck@lemmy.worldOP
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      5 months ago

      Thanks for the super-informative post :) I’ve had a look around some more machines and there’s some i3’s in the mix too. Think I’m going to try Mint xfce on one of them and see if it copes. Yeah, consolidating ram seems like it should be a priority. There are a few i3 machines sitting headless gathering dust on the floor, they seem like a good place to scavenge from

  • undrwater@lemmy.world
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    5 months ago

    It’s where Linux really shines, to be honest. Those specs will be fine. Great learning opportunity for the students too.

    • IsoKiero@sopuli.xyz
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      5 months ago

      Absolutely. Maybe leave Gnome/KDE out and use a lighter WM, but they’ll be just fine. Specially if they have 8GB or more RAM. I suppose those have at least dual core processors, so that won’t be a (huge) bottleneck either. You can do a ton of stuff with those beyond just web browsing, like programming/text editing/spreadsheets and so on. I’d guess that available RAM is the biggest bottleneck on what they can do, specially if you like to open a ton of tabs on your browser.

  • ladicius@lemmy.world
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    5 months ago

    Friend of mine runs Linux on a 15 years old cheap consumer laptop, and it’s working smoothly for browsing.

    Just try. There’s no risk and no costs trying. Have fun.

  • solrize@lemmy.world
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    5 months ago

    The biggest demands will come from the browser and its media players, not the OS. An i5 with 4gb RAM will be ok. Anything less will be marginal or worse. The modern web sucks. Did you know that mobile phones are starting to come with cooling fans? OMG.

    • cmnybo@discuss.tchncs.de
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      5 months ago

      There are very lightweight media players available that will run on anything with enough CPU power to decode whatever codec you are playing. It’s modern web browsers that will be an issue with less than 4GB of RAM. There are lighter web browsers, but they usually don’t support javascript or have very limited support for it.

  • Zachariah@lemmy.world
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    5 months ago

    Got with Xfce edition of either EndeavourOS (Arch based) or Mint (Ubuntu based). They’re both easy to set up.

    XFCE is a lightweight desktop environment with all you’d expect from a Windows 7 machine (and more).

  • some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org
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    5 months ago

    I think those reporting success running Linux on old hw should state the distro and window manager that they’re using if they want to provide useful feedback. I’m not in that group, but Tiny Linux comes to mind. Possibly Alpine? Probably better info to be had from daily-drivers.

    • cmnybo@discuss.tchncs.de
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      5 months ago

      If the machine has 4GB of RAM, then MATE, XFCE, LXDE, and LXQT will work well. I’ve used all of them on older computers. The distro doesn’t really matter. If it has 8GB of RAM or more, it will run any DE you want to use.

      If the machine has less than 4GB of RAM and can’t be upgraded, it’s not going to be very useful. Sure, you can put a lightweight window manager on them, but they are not going to run a web browser well. They could still be used for teaching students how to install Linux though.

  • TimeNaan@lemmy.world
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    5 months ago

    It’s exactly what I did when I was a student. There was an old pc that had a broken winXP install. I put Xubuntu on it and made it publically accessible to the students. They loved it.

  • Eugenia@lemmy.ml
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    5 months ago

    This is my rule of thumb and process to choose DE and distro:

    1. Find the CPU model and do a google search with it and the word passmark. The passmark page will tell you how fast the cpu is. If it’s between 500 and 1000, use XFce as your desktop environment. If it’s between 1000 and 2500, you can use Cinnamon (Linux Mint). If it’s more, you can use kde/gnome. If it’s less than 500, use LXQT or LXDE.
    2. How much RAM there is in there. These days, you need a minimum of 4GB of browse the internet (the DEs/distros themselves might use less than 1 GB of RAM, but the moment you open a web browser in this day and age, all hell breaks loose with memory usage). For best performance, 8+ GB is better.
    3. Ensure that it has over 16 GB of a drive. At 16 GB (as in some old Chromebooks), only Debian fits these days (with 6 GB free space after installation). Mint and the others prefer over 24 GB (both fedora and all the ubuntu-based ones are too big to fit in 16gb without issues – debian fits).

    Using these rules, I’ve converted many laptops and computers for my family here in Greece, installing the most appropriate each time. The least powerful computer was my mom’s old laptop, with 16 GB internal, 2 GB of RAM, 600 passmark points. As long as she’s only opening 1 tab on Chrome (Debian/XFce), she fits in the 2 GB RAM without swapping (most of the time). I use Chrome and not Firefox for these older laptops because Chrome uses LESS memory than Firefox (there’s an additional setting for it in the settings to help the matters more), and its youtube playback speed is much better too. I use firefox on more powerful computers, and it’s my default too, just not for underpowered computers.

    • refalo@programming.dev
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      5 months ago

      passmark is not a real world application, so its scores are meaningless in the real world.

      I have seen respectable communities outright ban any use or discussion of passmark or cpubenchmark type sites

      • Eugenia@lemmy.ml
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        5 months ago

        For me, it works just fine as a decision point. And real work usage of the computers I moved to Linux was very similar to what they report, they reflected just fine. So I don’t see any point to not use it, or even more so, to not suggest it to others, when the discussion warrants it.

  • twinnie@feddit.uk
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    5 months ago

    As long as you can secure them it should be fine, and as long as you can deal with the user account issues. You’ll either need to join them to your Windows domain or explain to people why they can’t use their normal username and password. You’ll probably find the kids understand it better than the teachers.

    • puck@lemmy.worldOP
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      5 months ago

      Yeah, securing them might be the biggest challenge tbh. I work full-time at the school and won’t really have time to provide tech support. The windows machines are ‘managed’ by a third-party IT solutions company, but like I said they’re mostly useless at this point and are rarely turned on anymore.

      Students don’t have user accounts so a generic log in could work. could see the school not allowing a Linux install without some sort of management/tech support procedure in place though. Security is probably the biggest hurdle to clear but I guess if we’re paying an IT company to manage window machines I don’t see why they couldn’t support Linux too, unless they’re unfamiliar with the OS :(

      • teawrecks@sopuli.xyz
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        5 months ago

        I mean, any modern Linux distro will be more secure out of the box than win 7/8 which are several years past their end of life.

        • puck@lemmy.worldOP
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          5 months ago

          Oh for sure, it’s just explaining that to boomer management that’s tough

          • teawrecks@sopuli.xyz
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            5 months ago

            I would just tell them, “look, Microsoft, the people who made this software, are telling us to never connect it to the internet again because it’s insecure and will get viruses. Our only options are to either pay for new licenses for their latest OS for each machine (which probably isn’t even compatible with the old hardware) or install a completely free OS that is open source and will promote tech literacy with our students.”