“We don’t think that censorship (including through demonetizing publications) makes the problem go away.”

More than 200 Substack authors asked the platform to explain why it’s “platforming and monetizing Nazis,” and now they have an answer straight from co-founder Hamish McKenzie:

I just want to make it clear that we don’t like Nazis either—we wish no-one held those views. But some people do hold those and other extreme views. Given that, we don’t think that censorship (including through demonetizing publications) makes the problem go away—in fact, it makes it worse.

While McKenzie offers no evidence to back these ideas, this tracks with the company’s previous stance on taking a hands-off approach to moderation. In April, Substack CEO Chris Best appeared on the Decoder podcast and refused to answer moderation questions. “We’re not going to get into specific ‘would you or won’t you’ content moderation questions” over the issue of overt racism being published on the platform, Best said. McKenzie followed up later with a similar statement to the one today, saying “we don’t like or condone bigotry in any form.”

  • fubo@lemmy.worldEnglish
    878·
    11 months ago

    To be clear — what McKenzie is saying here is that Substack will continue to pay Nazis to write Nazi essays. Not just that they will host Nazi essays (at Substack’s cost), but they will pay for them.

    They are, in effect, hiring Nazis to compose Nazi essays.

    • mo_ztt ✅@lemmy.worldEnglish
      2215·
      11 months ago

      Not exactly. Substack subscribers pay subscription fees, the content author keeps roughly 80% of the fees, and the rest goes to Substack or to offset hosting costs. The Nazi subscribers are paying the Nazi publishers, and money is flowing from the Nazi subscribers to Substack because of that operation (not away from Substack as it would be if they hired Nazis).

      • TrickDacy@lemmy.worldEnglish
        238·
        11 months ago

        This ignores that the platform is needed for that income to be possible. But truly you’re just being pedantic

        • mo_ztt ✅@lemmy.worldEnglish
          1110·
          11 months ago

          How is it pedantic to point out that “will pay for them” means “will get paid by them”?

          There’s a perfectly good argument to be made that Substack shouldn’t host Nazis even if they’re making money off them. But that wasn’t (edit: your the) message; your the message was, they’re hiring Nazis. It’s relevant whether they’re materially supporting the Nazis, or being materially supported by a cut of their revenue.

          • TrickDacy@lemmy.worldEnglish
            53·
            11 months ago

            It wasn’t my message, but it certainly made sense to me and still does. whereas your message makes sense but in a totally different way. It’s basically “nuh-uh”

            • mo_ztt ✅@lemmy.worldEnglish
              2·
              11 months ago

              Hm. Fair enough. The core complaint I have with banning Nazis from being able to speak, has nothing to do with which way the money is flowing. And I fixed “your” to be “the”; I just hadn’t noticed you weren’t the person I was talking with before.

      • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldEnglish
        63·
        11 months ago

        That’s splitting hairs. Salespeople who work on commission are keeping an amount of what they make for the company, but I doubt many people would claim they aren’t being paid to sell a product.

        • be_excellent_to_each_other@kbin.social
          52·
          11 months ago

          They are being paid by subscribers, not by substack. I am not on substack’s side here, but that detail seems quite relevant if we’re interested in painting an accurate picture of what’s going on.

          If they were putting Nazi content on substack and no individuals were subscribing to read it, they would be earning 0.

          Substack is profiting from those same subscribers, no doubt.

          • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldEnglish
            51·
            11 months ago

            They are being paid by subscribers, not by substack.

            Again- If you sold widgets door-to-door for a 20% commission, would you say you were being paid by the people who buy the widgets? I doubt many would.

            • be_excellent_to_each_other@kbin.social
              22·
              11 months ago

              In that case I’d be selling something made by the entity giving me commission - what people want and pay for is something made by someone other than me. In this case the people creating the content are the same people drawing the subscribers, so it’s more accurate to say substack takes a cut of their subscription income than to say substack pays them.

              If I stop selling widgets the company still has the exact same widgets and can get anyone else to sell them. If a renowned nazi writer (bleh) takes their content to another platform, substack no longer has that content (or the author’s presence on their platform) to profit from.

              • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldEnglish
                41·
                11 months ago

                what people want and pay for is something made by someone other than me.

                Sort of like Substack’s servers then?

                  • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldEnglish
                    11·
                    11 months ago

                    Your words:

                    what people want and pay for is something made by someone other than me.

                    They’re paying for the convenience of using Substack’s servers. The Nazi could be spreading their bigotry through direct email, for example, but that is not a profit-generating enterprise. Substack, however, is a profit-generating enterprise. Notice that they said they aren’t even willing to demonetize Nazi accounts. They are happy to make a profit from Nazi content. And for some reason, you think that is defensible.