Watching a documentary, there was aremark from the journalist on how, due to how wildly taxation on goods may vary, from area to area, in the US, most retailers do not put the full prices on the shelves and instead just tally it at checkout.
This made no sense to me, a european, as when I go to any regular shop, prices already include all taxes applicable to the product.
There are specialty stores where VAT and other taxes may not be applied on the price on the shelf but those are usually wholesellers, selling for professionals, that already know what additional taxes will be added and at which rates, at checkout.
Not having the full price you’ll be paying, on display, seems very underhanded and a bad practice. The client should know how much they are going to pay from the moment they pick an item.
As far as I can tell, once the question about price is asked, they will make a remark about how awful the Republicans or Democrats are (depending on their leanings).
Yes.
Let me tell you when, why, and how I learned that you need to pay attention to taxes.
I was in third grade and my class had a field trip. This was 47 years ago, so the exact details of the trip are lost to time and rusty memory. The lesson remained.
There was something that the class could purchase at the end of the day on the trip and the place only took cash and the school was not doing anything to help, except tell the kids about it and the price. Which was something like $5. I told my Mom and she handed me a $5 bill, plus a quarter, which confused my 3rd grade brain. She said to due to some strange words "sales tax, which was 5% in my state at the time. Got to school that morning and all my classmates were proud that they had their $5 bill, but none seemed to have a quarter. So I kept the presence of my quarter a secret and was a little embarrassed about it. Yes, I was young and stupid. Now I am old and stupid.
When it came time to purchase the whatsit at the end of the day, me and one other of my classmates produced a quarter to buy it. The teachers and chaperones had to cover the sales tax for the other 20 kids and they were pissed.
I went to school and learned a lesson that has stuck with me for nearly 50 years.
When you say “people” you’re really talking about the stores, right? The stores just put the price they charge, not the taxes which they don’t get. Yes, taxes vary from state to state, but it’s not like we’re all going to different states every day. I know what the tax rate is in my area, and so I know to add that when I see a price in a store.
If you really mean “people” as in customers, it depends. If I’m telling someone that a store has a good price, I’ll just quote the store’s price. But sometimes when I’m talking about what I paid, I’ll include everything “Wow, I can’t believe this cart of groceries was $150…”
It would require zero effort for the stores to post the actual prices. This is just another example of Capitalism Stockholm Syndrome that’s displayed by so many Americans. This practice is dishonest and serves no other purpose but to deceive the consumer.
No one is deceived. We all know there are taxes.
It’s certainly for the store’s benefit, not the consumer’s, but you’re over stating things. Sure, there’s no incentive for the store too post anything other than the price they charge, and not the state and federal charges the government layers on top of that. There’s no law requiring them to do so, and obviously they’d rather post the smaller price. We could change that by making it a law, but no one really seems to care that much - just doesn’t seem like that big of a deal.
Counterpoint to this is gas stations and the fact that they include taxes in the price on the giant sign by the road. Why should retail be any different?
Only an American would assume that when someone says people they mean companies instead of, you know, people. 🤦♂️
Why do consumers accept a system like this? Wouldn’t it be just better for consumers if the shop pricetag represented the exact amount you have to pay at the counter?
Sure, sounds nice. But is it bad enough that people feel compelled to create a ballot measure and get it changed? Apparently not.
Yeah apparently so. I guess it’s not the top of mind problem Americans have right now.
Over here various pro-consumer watchdog organisations would protest wildly and the merchant would most likely get fined for false advertising. So the whole thing feels a bit alien to me.
Sure if we started the whole tax thing today we may do it different. But it’s culture created over time. Our sales taxes all started during and shortly after the Great Depression in the 1920s. I’m sure store owners likely preferred people realize what they were charging vs the govts take. This is why I like it now. It’s very clear what the govt is taking and what the store is charging. It doesn’t bug me at all to have it added on at the register. It’s all I’ve known for 40 years. Currently I even live in a state with no sales tax (recently moved here), but I’m in a small tourist town that implemented a “resort sales tax” of 1% to help pay for city services related to tourism.
I think there’s also a fundamental cultural difference in that “govts take”. We don’t normally see taxes as “taking” in that sense, but I fully understand where you’re coming from - it makes sense and seems to work for you guys.
Sales taxes vary based on city, county, and state rates. They can also be waived if you, the buyer, have a reseller permit or are purchasing for a non profit.
It’s not underhanded and is annoying for sellers too because they have to know a lot about sales taxes as well. They could show you the price with local taxes included but then most customers would think their prices are too high comparing to other merchants.
So the price shown on the product in a store or online is only what the merchant is selling it for. The price at the register is what the merchant is selling it for plus the taxes they have to collect (unless you’re excluded for the reasons mentioned above).
The tax is a buyer obligation, not a seller obligation but sellers have to be an intermediary. So buyers should be educated about the tax laws that apply to them (in this system).
The receipt should be clearly marked so you know exactly how much went to the product and how much went to tax. You can itemize and deduct your sales taxes from your federal income taxes if you’re so inclined to track it (and it’s a better result than the standard deduction)
It’s more complex than a VAT system but enables local jurisdictions to levy taxes to pay for various things applicable to their area.
🤷♂️
Whether or not I factor in tax is entirely dependent on the size of the purchase I’m making. For the vast majority of purchases I make on a daily basis, I don’t think about it at all. 7% of $2.99 is negligible to me. However, if I’m making a large purchase, or if it’s a purchase which I know is subject to additional taxes beyond the sales tax, then I might consider it. 7% of $2.99 may be negligible, but 7% of $29,999 is a significant amount all by its lonesome.
For most people, I’d imagine this is most common when it comes to purchasing vehicles, as those tend to carry large prices and special taxes which results in a significant increase in price. For example, I purchased a new vehicle a couple years ago for MSRP, but wound up paying several thousand dollars more than that due to various taxes and the registration fees. I didn’t know exactly how much those surcharges would be (though I easily could have calculated them by visiting my state’s Department of Motor Vehicles website and plugging a figure or two into their calculator) but I had a ball park idea which I could budget around. Also, I’m pretty sure the dealership I bought from provided an estimated total purchase price which included the fees for the locality it was located in. Unfortunately, most of that was irrelevant to me, as I had traveled from another state to purchase this vehicle, which illustrates the minor frustrations that an all-inclusive price tag would introduce in America.
Like, I don’t think you’re wrong for thinking it’s odd, and yes, there are ways to fix it, but it’s just such a non-issue (not to mention America’s “touchy” relationship with taxation meaning these attempts to “fix” things would rapidly become politicized) that no one cares to do anything about it. As someone else said, we intuitively learn what the rough tax rate will be for our common purchases and just factor that in.
We just think about the base price, but the taxes. Then at checkout you’re told “oh, that number you had in your head? Add 5-20% more as a surprise”
It’s a terrible system, very anti consumer. You never get used to it
Oh, and it also has the fun side effect of making sure nothing ends on a dollar amount
The average American does not include taxes in prices. This is also true in Canada.
That is so bizarre.
It’s inconvenient for sure. Sales tax varies so much accross North America that I guess it’s easier for them to advertise that way vs. custom signs for each province/state.
That’s pretty much it. You have state, county, local/municipal taxes and it can get pretty convoluted real quick.
I would fully accept a law that allowed companies to advertise nationally the pre-tax price with a small disclaimer saying applicable taxes vary by location, and then require the in store price tags to reflect all taxes.
There’s no excuse not to anymore. Yes it does vary, and a computer can easily adjust the price.
That’s why they feel that taxes are robbery tbh. It mentally works against them.
Agreed
Annoying as well. Goodluck convincing anyone to change it.
Many of us are in the habit of mentally calculating it wherever we live though.
For example, my state sales tax is 6.88%, my county has a .25% tax on top of that, and then there’s a metro area tax of 1% on top of that my city does not impose a separate tax of their own so total sales tax in my city is 8.13%.
When shopping we’ll do the mental math (roughly) and factor that in so it might say $39.99 + tax but I know that it’ll be a little under $44 with tax.
It’s inconvenient but, like most things, we get used to it and adapt. Also, while tax varies a lot by state, most of us don’t venture too far out of our home area so tax is roughly the same all the places we regularly go.
It would be nice to have the price listed as the price you pay but it doesn’t work as well with our current system.
We don’t include the tax. You just expect what you pay at the till to be some percent more than the sum of shelf prices. It’s a known number, 5% where I live except on a few untaxed items (which I should mention isn’t the US, just nearby).
Who could have guessed u/CanadaPlus wasn’t American!
Ignore it.
Sometimes I am like egh, that’s annoying and more than I expected and then carry on with buying whatever it is. But that is a more recent thing, now that am being more frugal. For like a decade I would say I never acknowledged it or thought about it.
As someone who lives in one of the states without sales tax, i used to hate it because nothing would ever be exact change, id see a candy bar listed for $1 but actually ifa 1.05 or aomething and now Ive gotta deal with a bunch of coins. Arizona iced tea for 99c… Nah bro you still need aother 12 cents (gotta pay the bottle deposit too)
Its not as annoying now that i pay for most stuff with a card, but in still resent all the other states that force people to do math.
A lot of convenience stores around me don’t even have any prices shown on many items. Drives me crazy, but I guess many people are used to it? Sales tax is usually around 7% in most places I’ve been to, so if I know the price of an item, I know, roughly, what to expect.
No price means I won’t buy. Because it means probably 200% mark up at least
No prices? Things are getting worse.
Yeah, that’s crazy to me too. Never happens in Canada, unless somebody messed up when shelving things.
I think that would actually be illegal here, since price advertising is very regulated. For example, you must be given the price displayed even if it’s an error.
I’ve been in a bunch of convenience stores in Ontario that don’t have prices on items. this has been going on for at least nearly 10 years.
We did a trip to the US that covered coast to coast by plane and then 5000k of driving back to the centre… And their pretend pricing sucked.
Every state we went to advertised a price, but what you actually paid varied by heaps.
Bought some clothes that were something like $700USD by the tag, and had $1000USD on hand… Which wasn’t enough once they rang it up! Wtf?
That’s just called being scammed. There’s no 43% sales tax anywhere in the US.
Yeah, it’s shitty, but we also know it’s gonna happen. It’s not like it’s a surprise. Sometimes you might get a little extra sticker shock but it’s not as underhanded as it seems unless you’re very new to the process. The same way we tip, I just assume I’m gonna pay ~30% more than the price due to tax and tip.
I’ve also never had to budget so much that the specifics of the tax mattered to me, like I’ve never had to stretch money like that, so that could be part of it.
I’ve seen people discussing a cellphone offer that’s like “$800 but you get $800 of bill credits over 24 months” and they would say it’s a free phone. But you’d pay $800 plus tax up front and you’d not get that tax back.
Still a good deal, but it showed how many people were blind to the tax.
An extra six percent isn’t really the difference between a big purchase and a small one, so it’s pretty much just background noise for me. I know to leave some wiggle room if my budget is tight but don’t make the effort to calculate my technical maximum. Worst case scenario I get one less item than I planned.
